Offside incident

I was a NAR on a cup semi final at the weekend.

It was 4-1 to reds and blues were down to 10. It was just winding down into injury time when Red 8 played a through ball, which appeared to be aimed at Red 9. However, he attempted to trap the ball and it just ran straight under his boot, and ran between the centre backs to Red 10, who was onside when the ball was passed.

Now, when it ran under the boot of Red 9, it clearly brushed his studs. And I mean brushed. It was loud enough to hear, but it didn't appear to alter the trajectory or speed of the ball at all. Now, by the point he touched it Red 10 was offside, but he was onside when Red 8 initially played the ball. Now, I stuck my flag up as I'd heard the touch from Red 9, as had all the defenders in the immediate area and it was clear Red 10 was offside at that point. Even though it wasn't an intentional pass, the laws say that 'the moment the ball is played or touched by a team-mate', which to me says that any touch, even the brushing of studs, can lead a player to be offside.

Nobody argued with it, probably because Reds knew they were going to win regardless but I've been replaying the incident in my head and wanted to get some opinions on whether I was right to flag as I did. The thing that complicates it for me is that if Red 9 hadn't been there, the ball would basically have taken the same path at the same speed and Red 10 would have been onside in that scenario.

Thoughts welcome!

We don't need to look at the impact here nor change of trajectory. As you said, touched is the issue. If it touched him, then that's offside. This is actually a nice, clearcut application of law

Sorry to be blunt but stick to the laws and you won't go wrong. Red 9 was there, he did touch the ball, Red 10 was offside when that touch was made so I suggest you stick to the facts and make your decision from there. Try not to over complicate things.

Yampy said:

Sorry to be blunt but stick to the laws and you won't go wrong. Red 9 was there, he did touch the ball, Red 10 was offside when that touch was made so I suggest you stick to the facts and make your decision from there. Try not to over complicate things.

Click to expand...

Yep, that's sound advice! Was just one of those ones that I was replaying in my head.

I also had one as NAR on a semi final yesterday. 80th minute and 3-2 to blues. Whites were awarded a free kick just outside blues penalty area on the opposite side to me. I got in line with the second last defender and waited. White 3 was in an offside position when the free kick was taken then several defenders moved back. White 3 sent a bullet header straight into the back of the net, it was a great header! I immediately put my flag up and got the referee's attention. I informed him 3 was offside when the ball was played, 3 headed the ball into the goal, it's offside.
The referee went with my call (no reason not to but we have worked together several times and he knows he can trust me) and awarded the IDFK for offside. White 3 went absolutely mental; "you f'ing cheating c***". The referee immediately brandished the red card. The player wouldn't let it go and repeated his comment adding that I had been at it all game. Even now I'm bemused as to what I'd been at all game as I had been consistent with offside/not offside for both teams, only flagged for one foul which the referee blew for simultaneously and hadn't given a single decision against this player, not even a throw in!
I then had a smart arsed spectator telling me he had a photo on his phone showing defenders on the goal line. I didn't engage with him. In any case, the defenders weren't there when the free kick was actually taken but he wouldn't have listened anyway.
Why do we bother?

Know what you mean @PP62 ! Was a NAR on a big cup game recently ... had spectators giving me grief because the ball wasn't 'in' the arc on corners (clearly overhanging the line though obviously!) and player went crazy after I raised my flag when he jumped over the ball in an offside position and bang in the GK's line of vision

I came late into refereeing and am now into my fifties and have been officiating for about six years.

I recently was AR for a ladies game. blues were defending and cleared the ball. Reds played a long ball back from inside their own half as all the players were moving back towards half way line. The lone red forward was half a yard ahead of all the defenders, but reacted slowly and allowed a blue defender to rush past her and chase down the ball. I kept my flag down, since the red attacker in OP had not entered active play. The red attacker also chased back and just as the blue defender reached the ball, harried her from behind. I now raised my flag but the referee did not see it at once.

When he did become aware of me, it was just as the ball went out for a corner. He ran over towards me, but to my surprise, stopped about 20 yards away and said loudly: 'You're not going to tell me that was offside?'. I replied that it was. he said: 'No way, she came from well behind the defender.' I was aware of both teams standing listening and merely replied. 'Your call.' and ran into position for the corner'

This bugged me a little at the time, and has actually grown more annoying over the last few days. I have no problem at all with being over-ruled, but I felt his manner was belittling and dismissive. I am not a kid, but he made it sound to the players like I had made a rookie error. He could simply have over-ruled, or come over for a (private) word. He had earlier also over-ruled on a corner decision where I was a good ten yards nearer. I had flagged the corner he said "no, touched the attacker last" - I immediately altered for flag signal to goal kick but both teams stood looking very surprised for twenty seconds (I think everyone was sure it was a corner).

After the game I said nothing, he was friendly and chatty, and I felt it might be petty to bring this up. But what happens if I have to AR for him again? Do I mention this at all? Or am I being over sensitive?

Dan56 said:

stopped about 20 yards away and said loudly: 'You're not going to tell me that was offside?'. I replied that it was. he said: 'No way, she came from well behind the defender.'

Click to expand...

i must admit i spoke to a CAR in this way, not exactly, but it had a similar dismissive tone to it, once,. He came to me after the game to say that he wasnt upset about the over rule, but the fact that i hadnt given him the respect to at least go and have a private chat with him and consider what he had seen. I really took that on board and have not done anything like it since. Even if a CAR is terrible, they are not there to be humiliated. In a debrief you'd expect a ref to ask how things went, and if i had been in your position i think i would have brought it up at that point.
If you come across him again, mention it... whats the worst that could happen? It might just make him think

It's really poor form to undermine a fellow official like that, especially if they are a NAR. Every time I've been a NAR with a higher level ref, they have all said in their pre-match that offsides are all mine and they'll only intervene if there is a spectacularly good reason, like I've fallen on my arse or something.

I would definitely bring it up, because it doesn't help the anyone if the teams think he doesn't trust his officials.

I'm not one for confrontation in the changing room @Dan56 but I would have had a go after the game. That's just unacceptable. I have never had a problem with a referee waving my flag down, it's happened loads for one reason or another (I was never wrong though!! and @ASM waved a few of mine down!) but have never had a referee speak to me like that during a game.
By the way, like you I was a late starter and now in my 50s. Still enjoying it too.