A&H

Change to Observer report writing Level 4

J

James Wright

New Member
Level 4 Referee
Wanted to ask the general consensus of the new observer reporting format.

Are people feeling they are being marked lower than last year?
I understand the new format was created to make observer more consistent across the board...?
 
The Referee Store
Yes, a standard match is expected to produce a lower mark. The feeling of the observers is that the average mark will fall by about 1-2 marks. With the deductions for mistakes, we are expecting more sub 70's.

72 is the new 74, we need to provide facts so if these don't exist you cannot be marked up.
 
I got a 75 on my first assessment of the marking season - happy days!

Back to a good old 72 from Saturday, so no real change from last season.

I've never understood why, when no-one really gets lower than 67 and no-one really gets higher than 77, they can't just mark out of 10.
 
Ok seems to be the consensus from others I've spoken to as well. Makes me feel miles better about my first two reports of the marking season
 
forest96 said:
I got a 75 on my first assessment of the marking season - happy days!

Back to a good old 72 from Saturday, so no real change from last season.

I've never understood why, when no-one really gets lower than 67 and no-one really gets higher than 77, they can't just mark out of 10.
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It would make defining promotion/demotion candidates a lot harder. 1 point can mean the difference in banding? so you can do out of 100 or you'd have to look at a decimal point anyway.
 
forest96 said:
I got a 75 on my first assessment of the marking season - happy days!

Back to a good old 72 from Saturday, so no real change from last season.

I've never understood why, when no-one really gets lower than 67 and no-one really gets higher than 77, they can't just mark out of 10.
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In the marking season just finished I marked a 66. In the new marking season I marked a 78. Both marks stuck after review. Go figure.
 
I like the new process. I was observed last week, first one of the season, and got a 73 in a very boring non-event of a game. The best bit was I could almost work out the mark using the criteria that was published. I was happy with that, a few of my colleagues have got 68 to 70.

The only anomaly, which was on my mind towards the end of the game, is that the chance to get top marks in AoL is gone if you don't get a DOGSO or tear up leading to a red card. I had no chance to do either in my game, so it's still a bit pot luck that you get observed on the right games (and take the right action of course).
 
i'm just awaiting my first 'new style' assessment...

would expect a 71/72 with old criteria (i thought i did ok, obeserver thought otherwise!)...see what i end up getting!
 
es1 said:
i'm just awaiting my first 'new style' assessment from a game i've reffed...

would expect a 71/72 with old criteria (i thought i did ok, obeserver thought otherwise!)...see what i end up getting!
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The same change applies to 2B and 3.

From my point of view, I've not noticed a difference in the actual marks being awarded and am, therefore, happy. That said, my latest game was a critical 'must win' for both sides, and featured 6 cautions and 1 send-off for VC, in front of a crowd of about 800 or so. As that was officially rated a challenging / difficult game by the Observer, it unlocks the higher marking range. Of course, it also gives you more rope to hang yourself with in the event of you getting something wrong!

I like the new system, as the sub-competencies really do relate to what a good referee should be doing in terms of adding value to the match. It's very clear what you need to be demonstrating to the Observer.

If you have a non-event game, which has also happened to me already this marking season, then the onus is on you to tick as many of those boxes as possible by working hard. Don't slip to the level of the game. It's quite possible to give an above average performance in a 'boring' game.
 
Mewcenary said:
If you have a non-event game, which has also happened to me already this marking season, then the onus is on you to tick as many of those boxes as possible by working hard. Don't slip to the level of the game. It's quite possible to give an above average performance in a 'boring' game.
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I would suggest that this is sound advice across all levels of promotion seeking referees.......not just 4+.
 
For the uninitiated among us can someone just explain how the marks translate into the bandings (assume its the same below standard, standard expected etc), and also what you mark you have to average over the course of a season?
 
UKColt said:
For the uninitiated among us can someone just explain how the marks translate into the bandings (assume its the same below standard, standard expected etc), and also what you mark you have to average over the course of a season?
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70-73 is the 'expected performance' range. Anything below that is below. Anything above is, well, above.

As for what your average needs to be, that will vary between years, levels, leagues and what you want to achieve for the year.

A few years ago, the average Observer mark for referees at L3 was about 73.6.
 
lincs22 said:
You just need to increase the size of the bribe - as in life, you get what you pay for ! :smoke::D
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Paid for with a mass con, 3 dismissals, manager dismissal, asst manager dismissal, spectator misconduct, 5 cautions, a penalty, lots of hard work, great team work and the usual stuff.
 
Mewcenary said:
70-73 is the 'expected performance' range. Anything below that is below. Anything above is, well, above.

As for what your average needs to be, that will vary between years, levels, leagues and what you want to achieve for the year.

A few years ago, the average Observer mark for referees at L3 was about 73.6.
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It was, and I averaged bang on 73 and that put me in the bottom 25%, so that shows how tight the marks are grouped together. Thankfully my club marks were good so I survived the cut, although I then quit anyway ..!
 
UKColt said:
For the uninitiated among us can someone just explain how the marks translate into the bandings (assume its the same below standard, standard expected etc), and also what you mark you have to average over the course of a season?
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There isn't the concept of BS, SE, AS, etc, once you get to level 4 and above. At 4, 3 and 2B you get a mark out of 100, as Mewcenary has said. At level 4 (unless it has changed recently) you are put into bands A to E for both club marks and observer marks. I think if you finish in E for clubs and D for observers, or vice versa, you are automatically demoted unless it is your first season at that level.

At levels 3 and 2B you get your exact position in the merit table for both club and observation marks, plus an overall position where observer position is worth double that of club position - e.g. you are 55th out of 335 referees for observers and 123rd out of 335 for club marks, overall you are 70th. Not sure what the removal criteria is these days, think it is bottom 30% in observers and 25% in clubs, or vice versa, or if you fail to finish in the combined list top 40% in three consecutive seasons. The latter rule was brought in fairly recently, and the premise behind it was that there are a lot of referees that keep out of the demotion places, but will never, ever have a chance of going up, so they are clogging up places at L3.

Once you get to 2A, and this also applies to 3s acting as assistants and 4th officials to 2A referees, it reverts to the FIFA system of a mark out of 10, and if you get an incorrect KMD you cannot get over 7.9.
 
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