A&H

Less than 10 yards away, blocking the DFK

santa sangria

santa sangria

RefChat Addict
Very competitive, tight game, quite a few fans, tense atmosphere: DFK just inside the attacking half, close to sideline not on the whistle, ref is 10 yards away and moving towards the box to get into position... Defender, who was close to the foul, moves a little and stands a yard in front of the ball, attacker takes the DFK, defender lifts leg to block, ball goes out of play.... ref blows, YC for defender, orders a retake.

Was this correct?

I was AR and didn't get a chance to discuss after the game. Everyone is expecting a YC card but the laws say no, right... There is no preventing the DFK here. The ref should have allowed play to continue and given the attacking throw, right... This would not have been popular! Or am I missing something...?

"If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required
distance, the kick is retaken unless the advantage can be applied; but if a player
takes a free kick quickly and an opponent who is less than 9.15 m (10 yds) from
the ball intercepts it, the referee allows play to continue. However, an opponent
who deliberately prevents a free kick being taken quickly must be cautioned
for delaying the restart of play."

Do you have to get between player and ball to "prevent" the kick being taken quickly?
 
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defender lifts leg to block

there you have it right there, defender doesn't retreat then intentionally blocks the ball, there's the offence. retake and YC is correct IMO

where you're getting confused (i think) is that there is no offence where the kick is taken quickly and there happens to be a defender within 10 yards of the kick who then obtains possession of the ball
 
The key part for me here is the kick being taken quickly. From the description in the OP, this doesn't sound like a quickly taken kick and the defender has moved into a position to block the kick and then made a secondary movement to prevent it.

This sounds to me like a clear yellow for failing to respect the required distance and retaken kick.
 
hmm i think the key thing there is that the defender actively made a movement to put himself in the vicinity of the FK (a yard away) your ref could have interpreted that as delaying, or at least attempting to ....
 
Good point about whether it was taken "quickly" - I'd say it was taken quite quickly, it wasn't taken slowly. It could have been taken slower!

It was taken so quickly that the ref did not have time to register that the kick was about to be taken against a player one metre away. So, I think we have to say, it was taken quickly.

And, if I read the law correctly, the player has not prevented the DFK being taken quickly, if "being taken" means "being kicked"... so, play on... or?
 
santa sangria said:
Good point about whether it was taken "quickly" - I'd say it was taken quite quickly, it wasn't taken slowly. It could have been taken slower!

It was taken so quickly that the ref did not have time to register that the kick was about to be taken against a player one metre away. So, I think we have to say, it was taken quickly.

And, if I read the law correctly, the player has not prevented the DFK being taken quickly, if "being taken" means "being kicked"... so, play on... or?
Click to expand...

if you follow on from what you're saying then the defenders can set up inches from the ball as they're not preventing it from being kicked. obviously i know that's not what you mean but just trying to illustrate the point that it's not the free kick being prevented, it's the intentional block/non-retreat that makes this an offence
 
es1 said:
if you follow on from what you're saying then the defenders can set up inches from the ball as they're not preventing it from being kicked. obviously i know that's not what you mean but just trying to illustrate the point that it's not the free kick being prevented, it's the intentional block/non-retreat that makes this an offence
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I know that's logical but that's not supported in the laws is it?
It doesn't say it is an offence to "block" a free kick that is taken. It doesn't say that the law is different if you are 1 yard or 8 yards away. How else can you "intercept" a ball other than by raising a leg - there's no exemption here for "blocking".

I know I am being pedantic but that is the point here. IMHO this is why we have the whistle and why the attacker has to ask for the whistle, or the referee has to see the player in front of the ball and proactively announces a ceremonial (we all do it, don't we)... if an attacker is not prevented from kicking the ball to take a quick free kick then it's play on, no?

(Match context in this case was that the ref had lost control a bit, had bottled 2-3 YC offences for SPA, not given a few obvious late challenges, and this was I think, in his mind, an easy way to restore some control - as I say, the crowd and players were happy. But, as I say, I still think this was wrong...)
 
es1 said:
if you follow on from what you're saying then the defenders can set up inches from the ball as they're not preventing it from being kicked. obviously i know that's not what you mean but just trying to illustrate the point that it's not the free kick being prevented, it's the intentional block/non-retreat that makes this an offence
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Well, I am saying that... ;) or at least I am saying that's what the law says "less than 10 yards"... isn't the point of the law here that the attacker can't "trigger" a YC by kicking the ball at a defender, no matter how far they are in front of them...?
 
santa sangria said:
Well, I am saying that... ;) or at least I am saying that's what the law says "less than 10 yards"... isn't the point of the law here that the attacker can't "trigger" a YC by kicking the ball at a defender, no matter how far they are in front of them...?
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no, i dont think they can. if the person taking the free kick takes it in such a way that it's aimed at the defender (in a non-aggressive/violent etc way) as long as the defender has retreated or is in the act of retreating then i've no problem with it and it's play on. the offence comes when the defender doesn't retreat or then intentionally blocks the kick.
 
es1 said:
no, i dont think they can. if the person taking the free kick takes it in such a way that it's aimed at the defender (in a non-aggressive/violent etc way) as long as the defender has retreated or is in the act of retreating then i've no problem with it and it's play on. the offence comes when the defender doesn't retreat or then intentionally blocks the kick.
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Devil's advocate here again: number of mentions of "retreat" or "retreating" in the laws of the game = zero.
There's nothing in the laws that says a defender has to be retreating to mitigate a YC... is there?
And again, this law doesn't talk about "intentionally blocking" it says it is OK to "intercept" (only used once more in the laws in the glossary: To prevent a ball reaching its intended destination).

A player standing in front of a DFK who then blocks the ball is intercepting it, aren't they?

This is one of those times when common sense says YC but the law says play on, I think... any extra guidance docs anywhere?
 
santa sangria said:
Devil's advocate here again: number of mentions of "retreat" or "retreating" in the laws of the game = zero.
There's nothing in the laws that says a defender has to be retreating to mitigate a YC... is there?
And again, this law doesn't talk about "intentionally blocking" it says it is OK to "intercept" (only used once more in the laws in the glossary: To prevent a ball reaching its intended destination).

A player standing in front of a DFK who then blocks the ball is intercepting it, aren't they?

This is one of those times when common sense says YC but the law says play on, I think... any extra guidance docs anywhere?
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i think you're reading far too much into it...i'm sure you're right about it not being specifically mentioned in the laws...however i'm not sure the point you're making is relevant. this offence is clearly understood by players and referees imo
 
es1 said:
i think you're reading far too much into it...i'm sure you're right about it not being specifically mentioned in the laws...however i'm not sure the point you're making is relevant. this offence is clearly understood by players and referees imo
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I'm aware this is rocky road, and I am obviously waiting for more esteemed graduates than myself to chime in... but... big but... that is the point... this seems misunderstood. By the laws, it's play on... but players and refs think YC...!

I just checked the old laws. 2015-16 said "If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required distance: the kick is retaken".

The old laws also said this in the end part:
"If a player decides to take a free kick quickly and an opponent who is less
than 9.15 m (10 yds) from the ball intercepts it, the referee must allow play to
continue.

If a player decides to take a free kick quickly and an opponent who is near the
ball deliberately prevents him taking the kick, the referee must caution the
player for delaying the restart of play."

So, even under the previous un-re-written laws you had to prevent the kick being taken to get a YC...
 
santa sangria said:
I'm aware this is rocky road, and I am obviously waiting for more esteemed graduates than myself to chime in... but... big but... that is the point... this seems misunderstood. By the laws, it's play on... but players and refs think YC...!

I just checked the old laws. 2015-16 said "If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required distance: the kick is retaken".

The old laws also said this in the end part:
"If a player decides to take a free kick quickly and an opponent who is less
than 9.15 m (10 yds) from the ball intercepts it, the referee must allow play to
continue.

If a player decides to take a free kick quickly and an opponent who is near the
ball deliberately prevents him taking the kick, the referee must caution the
player for delaying the restart of play."

So, even under the previous un-re-written laws you had to prevent the kick being taken to get a YC...
Click to expand...

IMO 'prevents him taking the kick' include takes it but it is intentionally blocked
 
Law 13 requires that opponents are a minimum of 9.15m from the ball at the taking of it, so the onus is on the opponent to retreat to the required distance.

Clearly, there is the allowance in the law for the instance where a player inside this distance is able to intercept the ball from a quickly take kick however, the OP says the player moved and positioned themselves within a yard of the ball.

As a result, this player is should no longer covered by the exception stipulating when a player can intercept. They have repositioned themselves to solely prevent the kick being taken (and then made a second motion to prevent the kick).

For me, from the description given, this is a caution for failing to respect the required distance.
 
What I think the OP might be missing is that there are two reasons you can book a player when it comes to being awkward around a FK: Delaying the restart and failing to respect the required distance. And as you've pointed out, the law allows the referee to let "failing to retreat the required distance" slide if the fouled team aren't disadvantaged by a player deliberately not doing so.

From what you've said, the referee hasn't cautioned for delaying the restart, he's cautioned for failing to respect the distance. And given that the player has made a deliberate action to block the kick, I think he's stopped the referee from having the option to let it slide.
 
GraemeS said:
What I think the OP might be missing is that there are two reasons you can book a player when it comes to being awkward around a FK: Delaying the restart and failing to respect the required distance. And as you've pointed out, the law allows the referee to let "failing to retreat the required distance" slide if the fouled team aren't disadvantaged by a player deliberately not doing so.

From what you've said, the referee hasn't cautioned for delaying the restart, he's cautioned for failing to respect the distance. And given that the player has made a deliberate action to block the kick, I think he's stopped the referee from having the option to let it slide.
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Good stuff.
OK, that's a good rationalisation. From the laws:
"Cautionable offences: failing to respect the required distance when play is restarted with a corner kick, free kick or throw-in"

This is such a lonely line - and it's not explained anywhere else in the laws as far as my searching powers tell me. It also contradicts the "delaying the restart" part of the free kick law: "If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required distance, the kick is retaken unless the advantage can be applied;"

So, what interests me now is: what are the limits of the "failing to respect the required distance" law here - does this mean, unless there is a specific exemption (like quickly taken free kick) we have a lot of freedom here?

But, yes, great answer GS, the YC should be for FtRtRD not DtRoP ;) Catchy!
 
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