RefSix

Nightmare game

Zimmyman

Well-Known Member
#1
Ok Sunday was a nightmare for me after having 9 games with no trouble it then all comes along ! Sunday u14 fixture cup game
Game starts ok I must admit I had a slight mix up with Lino’s not being in the right position but they did not say anything to me till I’d kicked off ! But the game starts after 25 minutes on an injury I see two players leave the FOP for a drink on there return I cautioned them to the uproar of the coaches !! 10
Minutes later one of the cautioned players call me a juke so 2nd yellow and off ! The car was the dad of the boy so he walked also Manager of the team screaming all kind of abuse at me although not swearing !! So I sent him from the ground! Game calms down in second half one more yellow for dissent ! Into extra time 1-1 then one team scores with 3 mins to go this causes mayehem one player swears st me si
He goes ! Manager of the losing team does not like it he’s the number two of the manager I sent off ! He then marched into FOP to say he wants to end it ! So much mayhem that I tell him no
I’m abandoning more abuse being called the worst ref ever I’m a joke ! A disgrace etc
Not a great day and it starts me questioning my ability
 

Abeverley

Active Member
#2
Sounds like a tough one with aggressive managers. Sending them if they’re being abusive is spot on.
Perhaps you could have managed the 2 cautions earlier on with a chat? At that age they may be unaware of that part of the law. Having said that, they do need to learn.
That’s not a criticism at all.
Nothing can excuse behaviour like that durected towards you.
 

one

RefChat Addict
#3
Chin up Zimmy. We have all had those games. More than once. If you don't have them then you haven't been refereeing long enough.

I feel that you already know a couple of things that you could have done differently that could have possibly improved the situation but I don't think its about advice on "what should have done" now. It sounds like you did the best you could once things started going south. Teams with poor discipline don't need too much of an excuse to ruin a game.

Take whatever learning points you can out of this game, put it behind you and if you ask me, get straight back into it.

Questioning your ability after doing only 9 games should never even come into your mind.
 
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Zimmyman

Well-Known Member
#5
Thanks guys great advice ! Yes I could have done things differently particularly the going off FOP without permission that started it all really but they are 14 year olds with other mistakes that may have happend I did not need to be talked to like the way they was talking to me for all the second half I had control if the game apart from the bickering maybe I need to be a bit more tolerant ? But to be called a joke by a 13 year old does not do much for me as a way of respect I’m an older ref that in some cases could be their grandfather lol
 

Sheffields Finest

Maybe I'm foolish, maybe I'm blind!
#6
As @JamesL says you'll learn more from a tasty game than 9 walks in the park..A few on here, like me, go on about experience, experience, experience but some of the younger fraternity think that the sky is the limit too quickly... These crappy games are priceless in your quest to improve, next time you'll see things differently maybe and be able to act accordingly from an experienced point of view.. Chin up, move on!!
 

JamesL

RefChat Addict
#9
I dont think it does at any level if I am honest BC. As an AR at a stoppage I'll always go up towards the benches and be seen to be managing players coming over for a drink. If ey step off to grab a bottle i wouldn't expect the referee to caution nor would I myself but I urge them very quickly back onto FOP.
Zimmy - you've nailed what went wrong. Balancing the laws, common sense and having empathy for the game is a fine art mastered only by the best. Its easy to want to do everything strictly by the book and Im guessing given your reference to age this is something that is engrained. Sometimes you've got to think about what people are expecting.. remember they dont neccessarily know the lotg nor neccessarily care for them so on the face of it you've cautioned 2 kids for what I believe is a basic right of accessing clean water.
 

Zimmyman

Well-Known Member
#10
I dont think it does at any level if I am honest BC. As an AR at a stoppage I'll always go up towards the benches and be seen to be managing players coming over for a drink. If ey step off to grab a bottle i wouldn't expect the referee to caution nor would I myself but I urge them very quickly back onto FOP.
Zimmy - you've nailed what went wrong. Balancing the laws, common sense and having empathy for the game is a fine art mastered only by the best. Its easy to want to do everything strictly by the book and Im guessing given your reference to age this is something that is engrained. Sometimes you've got to think about what people are expecting.. remember they dont neccessarily know the lotg nor neccessarily care for them so on the face of it you've cautioned 2 kids for what I believe is a basic right of accessing clean water.
Thank you yes I totally totally agree with you I Got that one well wrong a big big learning curve
 

Zimmyman

Well-Known Member
#11
I dont think it does at any level if I am honest BC. As an AR at a stoppage I'll always go up towards the benches and be seen to be managing players coming over for a drink. If ey step off to grab a bottle i wouldn't expect the referee to caution nor would I myself but I urge them very quickly back onto FOP.
Zimmy - you've nailed what went wrong. Balancing the laws, common sense and having empathy for the game is a fine art mastered only by the best. Its easy to want to do everything strictly by the book and Im guessing given your reference to age this is something that is engrained. Sometimes you've got to think about what people are expecting.. remember they dont neccessarily know the lotg nor neccessarily care for them so on the face of it you've cautioned 2 kids for what I believe is a basic right of accessing clean water.
This is also such great advice and is making me see things a little differently now ! After just qualifying one tends to want to apply the laws as they teach you on the course ! Or why do it ?
But I see now where I must improve and change ! Thanks for the advice
 

GraemeS

RefChat Addict
#13
Ooof. As others have pointed out, every match has an opportunity somewhere early on where you get to show to the players what kind of ref you're planning to be. And while "picky" is a valid choice, and one I often aim for myself, I think you might have taken it a step too far on this occasion! BC has used the phrase "what football expects", and I think it's absolutely fair to say that football doesn't expect U14's to be cautioned for this kind of technical offence that harms no one. You've put yourself in a difficult position and had to send someone off as a result of that difficult position, where you could easily have made your own life easier without any significant dent to your refereeing integrity!

I'd also want to know two other things before even saying that you were right in law - are you 100% sure they actually left the FOP (and didn't just lean over or have bottles passed to them) and 2, are you 100% sure you didn't accidentally give them permission to step off: "Can we grab a drink ref?" "sure" is an exchange I've had before, which I didn't realise until after was essentially permission to leave the FOP. If either of those condition apply, it might actually swing away from pedantic and into incorrect.

And having said all that, it's worth reiterating that nothing justifies the abuse you ended up getting. Make sure you put in all the correct misconduct reports, including both managers and just try to take the learning points from this match and move on.
 

lincs22

Supply League Observer
Staff member
Observer/Tutor
#14
@Zimmyman - While the match is fresh in your mind, you should a self-appraisal of your performance. What went well, what have your learnt and what could you have done better. You will have done this in your mind, but putting onto paper (or an iPad) will aid your learning process.

Regardless of the 2 YC for leaving the FOP - you dealt with the other points correctly. The second YC could (and possibly) should have been a straight RC - so no change to the outcome. The conduct by managers at U14 is beyond belief - RESPECT campaign, any hear of that concept from the FA.

Lets hope the CFA deal with the managers properly for their behaviour. If we let them do this, then what are they teaching their players!!!!
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
#15
Begs the question, has anyone ever booked a player for leaving the FOP without permission? Entering FOP; yes, I could see that happening more often, but the only time I can think of a player going AWOL, is during a goal celebration (in which case half the team would need to see yellow)
 

lincs22

Supply League Observer
Staff member
Observer/Tutor
#16
Begs the question, has anyone ever booked a player for leaving the FOP without permission? Entering; yes, I could see that happening, but the only time I can think of a player going AWOL, is during a goal celebration (in which case half the team would need to see yellow)
Yes, when he has walked off at disgust at this own teams performance and into the changing rooms. The team had no subs to try and replace him.
 

Abeverley

Active Member
#17
Never done it but educated a player about it.
A foul was committed which caused a bit of handbags pushing and shoving.
Two players worthy of a yellow.
As I was cautioning the first one, the manger was having a go at the other kid who was about to get booked and he stormed off the field in a huff having being told he was being subbed for being so silly.
I told him to come back on, explained why he was getting a yellow and that he was very lucky that I didn’t give him a second one for leaving the field.
I doubt he will do it again.
 

Ben448844

RefChat Addict
#18
Communicating rule changes to all players and managers is nigh on impossible and it's on these issues that I've had to educate rather than card. For example, I had two occasions where I've given a yellow for what would've been DOGSO (red) challenges the season before. When I explained to the attacking team the change in law They often apologised for swearing at me initially lol. They just don't know the law and it's the same with leaving the FOP without the referees permission. You're in a position where you have to educate players/managers on things that they should know but rarely do.
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
#19
All of the Laws exist for a reason, but refereeing a football match is not an exact science. The art of when to be strict or lenient is a constant learning process.
We're supposed to intuitively know what 'football expects' and have empathy for everyone involved, whilst also educating players on the LOTG (which we know inside/out)
In situations where a player has breached a technical rule, consider all other options before going to the pocket. Sometimes the game reaches the best outcome, when you make a few decisions in your own best interests
 

GraemeS

RefChat Addict
#20
Begs the question, has anyone ever booked a player for leaving the FOP without permission? Entering FOP; yes, I could see that happening more often, but the only time I can think of a player going AWOL, is during a goal celebration (in which case half the team would need to see yellow)
Not personally, but I was running a line for a ref who said he'd done it. Last match of the season, a striker due to retire scores a probable winner in ~85th minute. Starts running in celebration, reaches the tunnel and just heads down it at a full sprint! Manager tells the ref that the player had warned him this might happen, so just asks to make the sub - ref says fine, but I need to book him for leaving without permission first. Waves a card at the tunnel then allows the sub on and finishes the match.
 
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