Play on or Failing to Respect the Distance

[OssieSC]

Fun one today, nothing first half then two reds and five cautions second half. One caution and red to the same player in very quick succession. I’m pretty sure I’m right in law on what I did but just wondering if there’s another way to potentially deal with this.

Second half team are 4-0 down, free kick in their defensive third, attacking player was by the ball that had been spotted, i tell him to retreat and he’s starting to move away. As he’s moving away defender kicks the ball at him, I’m assuming to try and get him booked but he’s moving away and not trying to play the ball. Second defensive player has a shout and then deliberately handles by picking up the ball. FK Attacking Team. I’ve signaled that been mobbed by a few players and one after I’d told him to go away continues on that I’m ****. Sin-bin for Dissent, at which point I’m a ‘****ing bellend’. Red card OFFINABUS and he adds that I’m a ‘****ing ****’. Wait for him to go move on with the free kick, bit later have a red card for violent conduct for the same team and then a few more yellows. Two NARs today said I handled it well but is this just a case of players not knowing the law or is there anything to do to avoid this sort of thing.

Cheers

 

[Ciley Myrus]

Yes

Stop game asap and go back to the original restart, fk to the defenders

Job done.


Picturebook knowing the laws here, but a bit naive in how to apply them...

 

[RobOda]

As Ciley says, go back to the original restart and for me, I would tell the defender to knock it off and get on with the game.

 

[OssieSC]

Yeah I do agree with you both, I’ve done that before and probably would do it again just think it was because of a completely different defender grabbing it and shouting that I went letter of the law rather than a bit safer but we live we learn.

 

[RustyRef]

Law is very clear on this as below. The attacking player who was moving away has done nothing wrong, the fault lies with the defender for trying to kick it at him and play should continue.

If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required distance, the kick is retaken unless the advantage can be applied; but if a player takes a free kick quickly and an opponent who is less than 9.15 m (10 yds) from the ball intercepts it, the referee allows play to continue

 

[Ciley Myrus]

Law is very clear on this as below. The attacking player who was moving away has done nothing wrong, the fault lies with the defender for trying to kick it at him and play should continue.

If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required distance, the kick is retaken unless the advantage can be applied; but if a player takes a free kick quickly and an opponent who is less than 9.15 m (10 yds) from the ball intercepts it, the referee allows play to continue

That is indeed the law,
But applying it has led to carnage
Being sensible with the use of the law would have been beneficial
Knowing the law, and knowing how to apply it, are two diff things
Anybody on earth can read and digest the instructions in the book
Its what they do with those instructions that define them as referees

 

[Peter Grove]

That is indeed the law,
But applying it has led to carnage

I disagree - I've done it many times and seen it applied many more, without any problems ensuing. It's a clear case of playing on, for me - exactly, as @RustyRef says, the Laws clearly indicate.

Admittedly, it has led to issues here but for me, that has been caused firstly by one player kicking the ball aggressively and unnecessarily at an opponent who was trying to get out of the way and secondly by another one trying to take the law (and the ball) into their own hands, not by the referee following the law.

 

[one]

Stop making the game easier for yourselves and harder the for the referee who actually applies the laws. The carnage in OP is indeed most likely because of LWR. Sorry to be so blunt on this. No one said refereeing is easy.

For OP, after free kick taken and ball hits/intercepted by defender who has not had time to retreat (and the ball has been kicked directly at him), PLAY ON. Any player picks up the ball after that, a NEW free kick for deliberate handball. All cards seem justified. Could have you avoided any of the cards by better management of the situation? I don't know, it's a YHTBT but it sounds like the player was hellbent on getting himself sent off.

PS: OP is a bit confusing as I think "attacking team" and "defending team" terms are not used correctly. The team with the possession of the ball or with a free kick is generally referred to as attacking team and the other as defending team. I usually use home/away team to avoid confusion because ball possession may change during an incident.

 

[Ciley Myrus]

as referees we of course have a duty to apply the law
we also have a duty to manage the game,
in the OP, game management seems to have been suited better to simply retaking

no, nobody can predict the actions of the other players and indeed they are responsible for that

but being proactive, we can help. that's game management.

 

[one]

The point is, you manage the game within the framework of the laws. Applying the laws within a game management framework (which is what seems to be suggested and is common place) is simply incorrect.

In layman's terms, feel free to bend the laws to give yourself better control but don't break them.

 

[Russell Jones]

as referees we of course have a duty to apply the law
we also have a duty to manage the game,
in the OP, game management seems to have been suited better to simply retaking

As @one has said, 'managing' this situation is going to make life (even) harder for referees in subsequent weeks. In this case your recommended approach is quite simply wrong in law. Given that around half the games at my level are observed, it would be self defeating for any official to do as you suggest. Man up @Ciley Myrus and just do your job rather than over complicating and confusing players / spectators even more than they already are!!

 

[Ciley Myrus]

It worked out well for the ref in the op....

Scotland had a national semi yesterday, Celtic v Abdn
Two mins in, fk to Abdn
Tried to take it quick, Celtic player danced around and blocked it

Our most experienced referee, simply retook the fk

Maybe he should man up too, or maybe, he able to manage it.

 

[GraemeS]

It worked out well for the ref in the op....

Scotland had a national semi yesterday, Celtic v Abdn
Two mins in, fk to Abdn
Tried to take it quick, Celtic player danced around and blocked it

Our most experienced referee, simply retook the fk

Maybe he should man up too, or maybe, he able to manage it.

And when you are Mike Dean, you also can do whatever the hell you wish !!!!!!!

?

 

[Ben448844]

Had this several times. I usually blow the whistle, tell the offenders to settle down and then we go back to the original restart. Number of issues I've had from that, 0. No red cards, no violent conduct, no silliness, nothing.

Why ruin the game over such an avoidable and insignificant act. I hope every one who quotes law applies the 6 second law every time etc etc etc

 

[Russell Jones]

Had this several times. I usually blow the whistle, tell the offenders to settle down and then we go back to the original restart. Number of issues I've had from that, 0. No red cards, no violent conduct, no silliness, nothing.

Why ruin the game over such an avoidable and insignificant act. I hope every one who quotes law applies the 6 second law every time etc etc etc

Yeah, bloody refs 'ruining the game' by applying "trifling" laws like (in this case) handball.

Why does application of this law matter (so much more than eg the 6 second issue)? Because free kicks, that should be an opportunity for the offended team to quickly recover any attacking threat are often messed up by defending players 'standing on the ball'. The fact that too many referees fail to appropriately deal with this issue has led to frustration and messy situations like the OP.

We complain that players don't even know the laws of the game that they are playing ..... and then compound the issue by deliberately choosing to incorrectly manage a straightforward situation.

Those who suggest simply retaking the original FK in the OP are knowingly denying the team who should be awarded the FK (for handball) an attacking opportunity in the final third of the FOP. Potentially game changing ......

 

[Ciley Myrus]

Losing the coin toss can be potentially game changing

If your playing on here,great
If your going back to the original fk, great

I know which one serves me best and which one I will be doing and someone getting upset in Kettering, Paris or Atalanta, is not going to influence it at all!

 

[one]

I had a game last year as AR. Both teams chasing an important 3 points to avoid relegation. Scramble in the goal mouth and a half hearted shout from one lone attacker that the ball crossed the line in goal. No one else was interested. I was on the goal line and clearly saw the ball crossing the line. I had to pick between flagging and let the referee deal with the chaotic aftermath or not flagging and business as usual. No prizes for guessing which choice I made. The referee managed the aftermath with just a one yellow for dissent and thanked me at the end of the game for courage.

Comparing the OP with 6 second rule is comparing apples and oranges. One can be considered trifling and the other can't. In OP there is no trifling. It's simply ignoring the laws and then making things up for the restart. There can only be two options for OP, yellow card and retake. Or DFK for DHB. retake with no YC is not an option ("I wasn't ready" excuse won't stick). Anyone having a retake without a yellow card would you also:

- Stop game for dissent, warn player (no YC) and start with IFK?
- Stop game for verbally distracting an opponent but no YC and start with IFK?
- Goal keeper comes of the line on a penalty kick and saves the shot. You retake the kick but don't give the keeper his (second) yellow card?

Each above doing the wrong thing makes it easier to mange the game. Have the courage to do what is fair and correct. Then deal with the aftermath as part of the job.

I know which one serves me best and which one I will be doing

We have different purposes in refereeing then. I am there to serve the teams.

 

[Ben448844]

Yeah, bloody refs 'ruining the game' by applying "trifling" laws like (in this case) handball.

Why does application of this law matter (so much more than eg the 6 second issue)? Because free kicks, that should be an opportunity for the offended team to quickly recover any attacking threat are often messed up by defending players 'standing on the ball'. The fact that too many referees fail to appropriately deal with this issue has led to frustration and messy situations like the OP.

We complain that players don't even know the laws of the game that they are playing ..... and then compound the issue by deliberately choosing to incorrectly manage a straightforward situation.

Those who suggest simply retaking the original FK in the OP are knowingly denying the team who should be awarded the FK (for handball) an attacking opportunity in the final third of the FOP. Potentially game changing ......

I cannot influence other games and nobody gives a flute about other games during the match that's currently in progress. We will be going back to the original restart with no incident every time. I'm afraid football at all levels has accepted the practice of stopping quick free quicks, just as its accepted not applying the 6 second law and many others and Ben on dog muck park in South Yorkshire is not the martyr to change this

 

[Ben448844]

Yeah, bloody refs 'ruining the game' by applying "trifling" laws like (in this case) handball.

Why does application of this law matter (so much more than eg the 6 second issue)? Because free kicks, that should be an opportunity for the offended team to quickly recover any attacking threat are often messed up by defending players 'standing on the ball'. The fact that too many referees fail to appropriately deal with this issue has led to frustration and messy situations like the OP.

We complain that players don't even know the laws of the game that they are playing ..... and then compound the issue by deliberately choosing to incorrectly manage a straightforward situation.

Those who suggest simply retaking the original FK in the OP are knowingly denying the team who should be awarded the FK (for handball) an attacking opportunity in the final third of the FOP. Potentially game changing ......

I'll refer to my playing career. I won several trophies, including two county cups (bagged the winner in one), won several league's and towards the end of my career,played in many games which decided whether my team was relegated or not. I've played in lots of 'important' games (if amateur football can ever be considered important).

My point here is that in all these games I've never seen the offence we're discussing as anything other than just a (wrongly) accepted part of the game. Everyone else is the same who I've ever played with. This goes up to the very top level of the game. So you have to ask yourself, are you doing it right and everyone else is doing it wrong? Or do you Look at the situation like everyone else, including the very best referees in the world.

 

[Russell Jones]

I'll refer to my playing career. I won several trophies, including two county cups (bagged the winner in one), won several league's and towards the end of my career,played in many games which decided whether my team was relegated or not. I've played in lots of 'important' games (if amateur football can ever be considered important).

My point here is that in all these games I've never seen the offence we're discussing as anything other than just a (wrongly) accepted part of the game. Everyone else is the same who I've ever played with. This goes up to the very top level of the game. So you have to ask yourself, are you doing it right and everyone else is doing it wrong? Or do you Look at the situation like everyone else, including the very best referees in the world.

Congrats on the playing career .. definitely more illustrious than mine .

If you read the full thread, I'm definitely not alone in my point of view on this .... then, to be fair, neither are you!

Most important thing for me is that we, as referees, do our best to enforce the 9.15m rule and get defending players consciously moving away from the ball rather than deliberately loitering in front of it. That avoids the inevitable frustration from the attacking team. Loudly policing this is the key to solving most problems and nipping it in the bud early in the game generally works well for me. However, in those (admittedly rare) cases where defending players have genuinely done nothing wrong and could not be expected to have been 9.15m away when the attacker chooses to take a quick FK then I'll still persist in applying the laws if it hits or is intercepted by a defender. Rereading the OP, the fact that the referee had to shout at the defender to retreat does rather suggest that he could have been doing more to get back the required distance ... but hard to know without being there!