I was reffing an end-of-the-season, mid-table 'nothing at stake' game the other day. Easy game to manage, low tempo, both teams wanted to play football etc. Attacker carries the ball past the halfway line on the right flank, defender comes sliding in, misses the ball but clips the attacker. It's a foul, but not even worthy of a quiet word. Attacker stumbles a few steps, but retains possession just inside opponents half with a good 30 yards of space in front of him, and the full back overlaps him on the outside. I'm right on top of it, both arms outstretched, loud shout of 'play on! Advantage!' Attacker immediately turns around to face his own goal, and shouts 'We don't want it ref', at which point a defender closes him down. I blew and awarded the FK for the original foul. I managed to sell it because he was closed down quite quickly, but defending team weren't too happy because they felt that i'd pulled it back because the attacker had asked for it. I can understand their point because when the foul was made, there was a very clear advantage to the attacking team. I'm in two minds as to whether pulling it back was the right thing or not. Thoughts?
Unwanted advantage
- Thread starter MatthewC
- Start date
Cheshire Ref
RefChat Addict
For me your loud shout of "play on, advantage" means just that, play on. Its not up to them to decide that they don't want it. Based on what you have said, crack on mate, you lost the ball because you stopped.
Cheshire Ref
RefChat Addict
Is that not what we do anyway??
Here in Canada, we got a directive just before Christmas that says (essentially) the following:
- Don't call for the advantage until an advantage has actually accrued. That avoids calling advantage and having to pull it back like was done here. It also has the added "benefit" of having everyone blow up at you because you were slow on the whistle on a foul.
- Don't use "play on, advantage" or "advantage, play on". Just use "advantage".
Ordinarily advantage doesn't accrue? Go back and award free kick.
If it doesn't accrue by virtue of a deliberate act by a player from the non-offending team, then I would expect play to continue.
If it doesn't accrue by virtue of a deliberate act by a player from the non-offending team, then I would expect play to continue.
This is the problem with the FA's insistence that advantage is signalled straight away at lower levels, referees then get grief when they pull it back. At L3 and above it is much easier as you can wait to see if it accrues before signalling, which means that is rarely if ever pulled back.
zarathustra
RefChat Addict
Ive never been taught to signal advantage straight away.
I feel that advantage is one of the strongest part of my game (backed up by assessors as well!) and I always wait until the attacking team has advantage before signalling it. I do the whistle to the mouth, late whistle if it's going no where or play on advantage if it does. Never been pulled up for doing it this way.
Kes
I'll Decide ...
I've personally never had a problem pulling them back if no advantage has accrued. It's all about how you sell it. So long as you're loud, confident and explain what you're doing immediately, there's no drama.
I can see how a not-so-confident or more timid referee would get eaten alive by the players for it though. It's (perceived) hesitancy that causes more problems with this sort of decision I'd imagine.... (?)
zarathustra
RefChat Addict
I've personally never had a problem pulling them back if no advantage has accrued. It's all about how you sell it. So long as you're loud, confident and explain what you're doing immediately, there's no drama.
I can see how a not-so-confident or more timid referee would get eaten alive by the players for it though. It's (perceived) hesitancy that causes more problems with this sort of decision I'd imagine.... (?)
Agreed I find if you indicate that you've seen the foul, and then when you blow up tell the players "There's no advantage, I'm bringing it back for the free kick" that they are, mostly, fine with it.
Up until this season it was in the competencies for level 7-6, and was even more clear in the level 4 competencies ...
- Clear immediate signals ...
- Having played and signalled advantage, stops game and awards a free kick when advantage does not follow within a few seconds
Kes
I'll Decide ...
Yeah, funny old thing.
Yet there are those on this forum who think that advantage shouldn't ever be played at grass roots level because the lack of skill and/or pitch conditions makes it a waste of time......
Padfoot
The Persecuted One
Yeah, funny old thing.
Yet there are those on this forum who think that advantage shouldn't ever be played at grass roots level because the lack of skill and/or pitch conditions makes it a waste of time......
Very very very few, if any, advantages played on a Sunday morning are beneficial.....the vast majority would be better served by the fk.
So many referees take risks with their match control in order to play a perceived advantage....whether they get away with it or not, it is a risk and will be picked up on when assessed.
Unless the ball is going into the net.....don't play the advantage.......holds true for 99% of Sunday league games, and probably 75% of Saturday games outside of the semi-pro game.
Kes
I'll Decide ...
I see you're happy (as ever) to fly in the face of general convention.
If the criteria for 7-6 include an understanding of and correct application of "Advantage" then how can you as an assessor say such a thing?
RegalRef
Politically Incorrect
I don't think you can generalise like that.
Ability levels vary massively just across Sunday leagues, not to mention better standard Saturday Leagues too.
I think we need to be looking for advantages as often as possible, but that doesn't always mean playing them. Talk to the players and explain why you chose not to play it, as opposed to just never offering it.
It's simple to generalise because there's a number of criteria which have to be satisfied before the situation can be judged as truly "advantage" to the non-offending team.
These are set out in Issue 26 of the Refereeing magazine
https://the-ra.org/assets/Referee Magazine Volume 26 single.pdf
Too many referees play advantage when it is simply the non-offending team retaining possession but without any increase in opportunity to attack their opponent's goal. Too many play it in the defensive third where there are to many defenders and/or distance between the position of the incident and the goal being attacked.
It's a fine line to judge and while I wouldn't fully support the numbers quoted by Padfoot, I do think too many referees play advantage because they think it looks good for them to keep the game moving.
These are set out in Issue 26 of the Refereeing magazine
https://the-ra.org/assets/Referee Magazine Volume 26 single.pdf
Too many referees play advantage when it is simply the non-offending team retaining possession but without any increase in opportunity to attack their opponent's goal. Too many play it in the defensive third where there are to many defenders and/or distance between the position of the incident and the goal being attacked.
It's a fine line to judge and while I wouldn't fully support the numbers quoted by Padfoot, I do think too many referees play advantage because they think it looks good for them to keep the game moving.
Padfoot
The Persecuted One
I see you're happy (as ever) to fly in the face of general convention.
If the criteria for 7-6 include an understanding of and correct application of "Advantage" then how can you as an assessor say such a thing?
Errr....because many referees lack the understanding and therefore the correct application of "advantage".......hence why I, as an assessor, can say that the majority of what referees give as "advantage" are not really advantageous and represent a risk to their match control.....whether that risk accrues or not is another story......
I may have slightly exaggerated the numbers.....but for referees going 7-6 or 6-5, the standard of games they are officiating on, the amount of proper advantages that they can play without risking their match control will be few and far between.....