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Political Logos

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Sheffields Finest

Sheffields Finest

Maybe I'm foolish, maybe I'm blind!
Level 7 Referee
Seems that they are allowing BLM logos and taking a knee in the EPL return. Not condoning the events in the USA but shouldn’t football stand back from all this and continue to enforce the no political / cause rule.
Ive BAME family and they are disgusted in recent events Involving BLM and others especially around the UK.
 
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My understanding is that anti-racism slogans have always been allowed and isn't considered a political symbol?
 
Sheffields Finest said:
Seems that they are allowing BLM logos and taking a knee in the EPL return. Not condoning the events in the USA but shouldn’t football stand back from all this and continue to enforce the no political / cause rule.
Ive have BAME family and they are disgusted in recent events Involving BLM and others especially around the UK.
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Not sure many will reply as the potential for forum misunderstanding is super high. From my perspective (which I trust may be very blinkered), the mantra 'ALL lives matter' would've been apt. Like everyone else, the EPL must be seen to make a statement, even if it is nothing more than just that
 
Big Cat said:
Not sure many will reply as the potential for forum misunderstanding is super high. From my perspective (which I trust may be very blinkered), the mantra 'ALL lives matter' would've been apt. Like everyone else, the EPL must be seen to make a statement, even if it is nothing more than just that
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No
 
Slogans, statements, images and advertising

Equipment must not have any political, religious or personal slogans, statements or images. Players must not reveal undergarments that show political, religious, personal slogans, statements or images, or advertising other than the manufacturer`s logo. For any offence the player and/or the team will be sanctioned by the competition organiser, national football association or to be justified by FIFA.

Principles
Law 4 applies to all equipment (including clothing) worn by players, substitutes and substituted players; it's principles also apply to all team officials in the technical area
  • The following are (usually) permitted:
    • the player's number, name, team crest/logo, initiative slogans/emblems promoting the game of football, respect and integrity as well as any advertising permitted by competition rules or national FA, confederation or FIFA regulations
    • the facts of a match: teams, date, competition/event, venue
  • Permitted slogans, statements or images should be confined to the shirt front and/or armband
  • in some cases, the slogan, statement or image might only appear on the captain's armband
Interpreting the Law

When interpreting whether a slogan, statement or image is permissible, note should be taken of Law 12 (Fouls and Misconduct), which requires the referee to take action against a player who is guilty of:
  • using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or gestures
  • gesturing in a provocative, derisory or inflammatory way
Any slogan, statement or image which falls into any of these categories is not permitted.

Whilst 'religious' and 'personal' are relatively easily defined, 'political' is less clear but slogans, statements or images related to the following are not permitted:
  • any person(s), living or dead (unless part of the official competition name)
  • any local, regional, national or international political party/organisation/group, etc.
  • any local, regional or national government or any of its departments, offices or functions
  • any organisation which is discriminatory
  • any organisation whose aims/actions are likely to offend a notable number of people
  • any specific political act/event
When commemorating a significant national or international event, the sensibilities of the opposing team (including its supporters) and the general public should be carefully considered.

Competition rules may contain further restrictions/limitations, particularly in relation to the size, number and position of permitted slogans, statements and images. It is recommended that disputes relating to slogans, statements or images be resolved prior to a match/competition taking place.

Offences and sanctions

For any offence play need not be stopped and the player:
  • is instructed by the referee to leave the field of play to correct the equipment
  • leaves when play stops, unless the equipment has already been corrected
A player who leaves the field of play to correct or change equipment must:
  • have the equipment checked by a match official before being allowed to re-enter
  • only re-enter with the referee’s permission (which may be given during play)
A player who enters without permission must be cautioned and if play is stopped to issue the caution, an indirect free kick is awarded from the position of the ball when play was stopped, unless there was interference in which case a direct free kick (or penalty kick) is awarded from the position of the interference.
The floodgates are now open!
 
When the Cenotaph was besieged by the mob trying to burn it down last week, the police did nothing.
Now it’s being protected by patriots and veterans they move in in full riot gear.
Maybe “Defund the Police” will unité left and right in Britain?
 
Big Cat said:
Not sure many will reply as the potential for forum misunderstanding is super high. From my perspective (which I trust may be very blinkered), the mantra 'ALL lives matter' would've been apt. Like everyone else, the EPL must be seen to make a statement, even if it is nothing more than just that
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Going to jump in real quick before this thread gets shut down. Just can't see it lasting long.
The all lives matter is not in sync with the cause. To me it denies a problem exists for those of BAME heritage.
I saw a really interesting protestor sign that sums up the response to all lives matter perfectly:
"We never said only black lives matter.
Of course all lives matter.
We just need help with #blacklivesmatter for black lives are in danger. "
I totally get the all lives matter and I like to think that it mostly comes from well intentioned thought processes but the issue of the existing movement is to end the systemic racism that still clearly exists in today's society.
So, whilst all lives DO matter, it simply is not the slogan for the moment.
 
JamesL said:
Going to jump in real quick before this thread gets shut down. Just can't see it lasting long.
The all lives matter is not in sync with the cause. To me it denies a problem exists for those of BAME heritage.
I saw a really interesting protestor sign that sums up the response to all lives matter perfectly:
"We never said only black lives matter.
Of course all lives matter.
We just need help with #blacklivesmatter for black lives are in danger. "
I totally get the all lives matter and I like to think that it mostly comes from well intentioned thought processes but the issue of the existing movement is to end the systemic racism that still clearly exists in today's society.
So, whilst all lives DO matter, it simply is not the slogan for the moment.
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I won't be getting heated on the subject, but I just sense that things are not headed in the right direction
The message was diluted for me when they gathered in their thousands and broke the law. Sterling's comments about 'fighting one virus' riled me too. The goings on with the statues has been plain wrong. Can't recall who said that we're now living our history through the prism of the present... but they were bang on imo

Back to the OP, it's a no-brainer for the EPL. No downside and they have to be seen to do something
 
Big Cat said:
I won't be getting heated on the subject, but I just sense that things are not headed in the right direction
The message was diluted for me when they gathered in their thousands and broke the law. Sterling's comments about 'fighting one virus' riled me too. The goings on with the statues has been plain wrong. Can't recall who said that we're now living our history through the prism of the present... but they were bang on imo

Back to the OP, it's a no-brainer for the EPL. No downside and they have to be seen to do something
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No way a dig at you my friend, or suggestion of getting heated. Just a feeling that someone might come along and say something on the edge, and pop, fork goes in 😂
Can't agree more with you on that fact. The violence becomes the story not the reason for protesting. Sad really that folk can't see it.
Again for OP purpose it aligns with the kick it out campaign so can't see why they wouldnt do something alongside if not join in Completely, which they have
 
JamesL said:
No way a dig at you my friend, or suggestion of getting heated. Just a feeling that someone might come along and say something on the edge, and pop, fork goes in 😂
Can't agree more with you on that fact. The violence becomes the story not the reason for protesting. Sad really that folk can't see it.
Again for OP purpose it aligns with the kick it out campaign so can't see why they wouldnt do something alongside if not join in Completely, which they have
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It is a tinder box of a subject. Probably not a forum out there which hasn't gone into meltdown. Be good if we can buck the trend
 
I'll let it go for now as there are at least some references to football ... :)

My two penneth - I absolutely support the right to protest, at least in normal times. But these aren't normal times, gatherings of more than 6 people are illegal and simply should not be happing. With social media these days there are ways to protest without turning up in person and risking spreading the virus further. These protests simply would not be allowed to happen in places like Spain and Italy and would be broken up, with the use of force if necessary. I hope I am wrong but I fear we will be heading back into lockdown again in a few weeks and there will be only one primary reason for that, and as someone living in London it frustrates me beyond belief that thousands of people are congregating in this city for illegal protests. Putting aside the considerable issue that they risk infecting their friends and family, what is worse is that they are putting essential workers at risk, like the transport workers that get them into London and the police that have to deal with the protest crowds.

In terms of football, I don't see that allowing BLM logos and promotion is that different to the long running promotion of kick racism out material, after all both campaigns have the same desired outcome.
 
Big Cat said:
Not sure many will reply as the potential for forum misunderstanding is super high. From my perspective (which I trust may be very blinkered), the mantra 'ALL lives matter' would've been apt.
Click to expand...
Yes, of course all lives matter but as has been pointed out, if a house is on fire, you don't expect the fire services to say, "Actually, we're not going to deal with that fire just now because there are a lot of other houses out there and all houses matter." You deal with the house that's actually on fire first and if there are problems with other houses you deal with them as well, but it's not what you're going to concentrate on right away.
 
Peter Grove said:
Yes, of course all lives matter but as has been pointed out, if a house is on fire, you don't expect the fire services to say, "Actually, we're not going to deal with that fire just now because there are a lot of other houses out there and all houses matter." You deal with the house that's actually on fire first and if there are problems with other houses you deal with them as well, but it's not what you're going to concentrate on right away.
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What fire?

Can anybody on here give me an example of "systemic racism" here in the UK in the last 10 years?

What a bunch of thug coppers in the USA did to some black bloke does not translate to us here having a problem with being a racist society here. How could it?

My view of the BLM thing is that they may have more than a case for protest over there, but here, no way. Footballers wearing that slogan on their shirts is nothing more than PC virtue signalling and is helping to validate the disgraceful actions of a bunch of woke idiots hell-bent on causing unrest and calamity.

Sport and "politics" (not that it's even political) should stay apart.
 
Peter Grove said:
Yes, of course all lives matter but as has been pointed out, if a house is on fire, you don't expect the fire services to say, "Actually, we're not going to deal with that fire just now because there are a lot of other houses out there and all houses matter." You deal with the house that's actually on fire first and if there are problems with other houses you deal with them as well, but it's not what you're going to concentrate on right away.
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I'm not with you on the analogy, but given that my slogan was being used by a minority of yesterday's rioters, I think we can forget it
To have any potential to avoid divisiveness, the term needed to be used by the BAME campaign itself, from the beginning.
 
Kes said:
What fire?

Can anybody on here give me an example of "systemic racism" here in the UK in the last 10 years?

What a bunch of thug coppers in the USA did to some black bloke does not translate to us here having a problem with being a racist society here. How could it?
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I agree in that I don't think there is systemic racism among UK police officers and that we can't do much about the incomparable situation in the US
However, only 1% of police in this country are black. That's an eye watering number
 
Big Cat said:
I agree in that I don't think there is systemic racism among UK police officers and that we can't do much about the incomparable situation in the US
However, only 1% of police in this country are black. That's an eye watering number
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That's a whole different ball game. Anyway, how is it eye-watering? What percentage of the (adult) UK populace is black? I think you'll find that's quite a large number of coppers who are in real terms.

And besides, I wasn't referring to just the police, there's no systemic racism here full stop. Society here has put in place so much law (including employment law) to control and/or eradicate it during the past 25 or so years.
 
JamesL said:
Going to jump in real quick before this thread gets shut down. Just can't see it lasting long.
The all lives matter is not in sync with the cause. To me it denies a problem exists for those of BAME heritage.
I saw a really interesting protestor sign that sums up the response to all lives matter perfectly:
"We never said only black lives matter.
Of course all lives matter.
We just need help with #blacklivesmatter for black lives are in danger. "
I totally get the all lives matter and I like to think that it mostly comes from well intentioned thought processes but the issue of the existing movement is to end the systemic racism that still clearly exists in today's society.
So, whilst all lives DO matter, it simply is not the slogan for the moment.
Click to expand...
Totally agree. It's not the "all lives matter" slogan that is the problem, it's the fact that it's supporters using it to oppose the "black lives matter" slogan, even though not so explicit. For me "all lives matter" is clearly a anti-"black lives matter in disguise". Why else would it ever pop up any time there are "black lives matter" protests.

On a football note, I don't see this as a political matter, it a humanity matter even though it has been politicised by media. Football can still support the anti racial element of it without getting involved in the political side of it.
 
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