The Ref Stop

Sock Tape

@Padfoot

On the core development group I would not know because I'm not in one I have not been recognised or even asked to be put into core program so I don't even know if my rdo even looks at the reports
 
The Ref Stop
I was replying to his thread I don't know what my rdo does at my county fa accept for helping referees when in need and the other jobs he does that I'm not aware of
 
Padfoot said:
If you can't be bothered to get such a simple thing as sock tape correct, especially when being observed, it sets a poor tone right from the start. It shows a lack of attention to detail and is laziness on the part of the referee not to get it sorted.

Its an easy win, its been around now for ages, just get it right.
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But its not exactly inspiring when you see GKs in the PL/Champs with same colour shirt as referee - 2 or 3 times every week it happens.

If they can't be bothered to apply LOTG in that regard, then surely sock tape comes under the spirit of the game umbrella at grassroots level?
 
PinnerPaul said:
But its not exactly inspiring when you see GKs in the PL/Champs with same colour shirt as referee - 2 or 3 times every week it happens.

If they can't be bothered to apply LOTG in that regard, then surely sock tape comes under the spirit of the game umbrella at grassroots level?
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You're right there Paul, they don't really help us at all do they?

I agree with lots of the others with the sock tape stuff though. If you know you're being assessed there are certain things which are really simple to get right; players' equipment and substitutions spring to mind. If you're not being assessed and get into the habit of doing the simple stuff right then it becomes second nature and you don't have to worry about it when you are.

Sorry; I meant to say "observed" not "assessed"!
 
PinnerPaul said:
But its not exactly inspiring when you see GKs in the PL/Champs with same colour shirt as referee - 2 or 3 times every week it happens.

If they can't be bothered to apply LOTG in that regard, then surely sock tape comes under the spirit of the game umbrella at grassroots level?
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Paul, when you are refereeing the Champions League you do the job right and don't worry about anyone else. If you can do the job right on your game and deal with the flak that you get for others not doing it right, you're a referee my son (sorry Mr Kipling, but the cakes were exceedingly good).
 
PinnerPaul said:
But its not exactly inspiring when you see GKs in the PL/Champs with same colour shirt as referee - 2 or 3 times every week it happens.

If they can't be bothered to apply LOTG in that regard, then surely sock tape comes under the spirit of the game umbrella at grassroots level?
Click to expand...
"Spirit of the game" is not there to permit you to ignore the laws.
We all know the top tier referees do lots and lots of things wrong. Doesn't give you permission to do so at grassroots.
But also, 'when in rome'. I recently watched a game in my old stomping ground (and in Australia, each region tends to have one FA with it's own RA, under the larger state body. There are some 800 teams and 170 referees in my old area). Even the first grade at that regional level didn't abide by undershorts or tape.
Was it wrong? Yes.
But if that's what's happening, then it's impossible - even unfair - for any one referee to be bucking that trend (and for all I know that could have been an official decision)
Whereas where I am now, even U/12 or so is applying the sock tape law. But it's consistently done, so that's fine.
Of course, the only time I see undershorts/shirts and sock tape ignored at the men's level is when one of our A-League referees are doing them.....sigh....(A-League is our top tier pro comp)



GraemeS said:
A law is a law - I get that. But you've never debated if a law (outside of football) is justified or correct?
.
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Oh don't get me wrong - I firmly believe that both this and the undershorts law have absolutely no place in the LOTG and are yet another example of how IFAB have no understanding of the game below professional, televised matches.
These things should be subject to competition rules. That way if EPL want it that way, they can. But the Over 45s pub league doesn't have to follow it.
 
Just out of interest, what is the fascination with tape from a players point of view? When did it start?

I played for years and other than a tie up or tape to stop the sock from falling down (which couldn't be seen as the top of the sock is folded over) that was it. In 22 years as a player i never felt the need to start wrapping a load of electrical insulation tape all over my socks. Am i missing something?
 
Cheshire Ref said:
Just out of interest, what is the fascination with tape from a players point of view? When did it start?

I played for years and other than a tie up or tape to stop the sock from falling down (which couldn't be seen as the top of the sock is folded over) that was it. In 22 years as a player i never felt the need to start wrapping a load of electrical insulation tape all over my socks. Am i missing something?
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I think it's more to do with the current obsession with using the tiniest, simplest possible shinpads. So rather than having good old-fashioned shinpads with a sock-like bit and multiple straps going round the calf, they now basically just stick a bit of curved plastic down the front of their socks. And unsurprisingly, that moves around and so needs to be held in place with tape.
 
GraemeS said:
I think it's more to do with the current obsession with using the tiniest, simplest possible shinpads. So rather than having good old-fashioned shinpads with a sock-like bit and multiple straps going round the calf, they now basically just stick a bit of curved plastic down the front of their socks. And unsurprisingly, that moves around and so needs to be held in place with tape.
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That would make sense, it does make me laugh when they turn up looking like Ronaldo playing in Sunday League division 4 playing for Dog and Duck FC and can hardly pass the ball 5 yards.
 
can i just backtrack a little, i think someone mentioned players not having matching socks or shorts ... (or both)
in these instances, obviously you want the game to go ahead if its your regular, sunday morning fare... play the game and mention it to the league ?
and presumably if so , then inform the manager that you are doing that?
 
I'll be clear on this "sock tape does not matter" what matters is the LOTG which clearly state is has to be of the same colour. I've had assessors say they don't bother with tape but would i give them the chance to mark me down? No.

This is what I say to players:

This rule has been in place for a good few years and i'm sports direct sell every colour of the rainbow so if you want to wear tape spend £2.99 on a colour that matches your socks because if you don't you will be asked to remove it? you don't see me with white tape on do you?

But food for thought..................in youth football where players are supposed to be educated, I see every law regarding kit broke! sock tape, undershorts, under tops, yet because they are kids we let them play, maybe if we got the kids to remove the incorrect kit when they become adults we wouldn't have an issue.

Also the higher the level you referee at the less sock tape becomes an issue so if you don't want to progress don't worry about tape but if you do, well you're just gonna have to suck it up and enforce it.
 
Hi
Coming late to this. I try to deal with the sock tape issues and other equipment matters as they arise. White socks come off or are worn under the coloured sock, If I can't fix the tape issue I just report it and I tell the observers at it is reported. It is like the law 4 statement where it say that If the two goalkeepers’ shirts are the same colour and neither has another shirt, the referee allows the match to be played. Too often I see players with loose shin pads. I would rather see them taped securely with one small thin bit of tape preferably in the correct colour. I have zero tolerance on safety issues such as jewellery .
Personally I think that FIFA looked at this and decided that it wanted smart looking team rather than for any reason such as safety etc. I call that part the fashion police.
 
CapnBloodbeard said:
"Spirit of the game" is not there to permit you to ignore the laws.
We all know the top tier referees do lots and lots of things wrong. Doesn't give you permission to do so at grassroots.
But also, 'when in rome'. I recently watched a game in my old stomping ground (and in Australia, each region tends to have one FA with it's own RA, under the larger state body. There are some 800 teams and 170 referees in my old area). Even the first grade at that regional level didn't abide by undershorts or tape.
Was it wrong? Yes.
But if that's what's happening, then it's impossible - even unfair - for any one referee to be bucking that trend (and for all I know that could have been an official decision)
Whereas where I am now, even U/12 or so is applying the sock tape law. But it's consistently done, so that's fine.
Of course, the only time I see undershorts/shirts and sock tape ignored at the men's level is when one of our A-League referees are doing them.....sigh....(A-League is our top tier pro comp)




Oh don't get me wrong - I firmly believe that both this and the undershorts law have absolutely no place in the LOTG and are yet another example of how IFAB have no understanding of the game below professional, televised matches.
These things should be subject to competition rules. That way if EPL want it that way, they can. But the Over 45s pub league doesn't have to follow it.
Click to expand...

From a factual point, I thought the example given in laws re spirit of the game, specifically mentions allowing a game to go ahead without corner flag(s) eg ignoring the law.
 
Graeme, you are observed against a set of competencies, and one of those, under application of law, is that you accurately apply the laws of the game (don't have the full wording as I am on the other side of the World and don't have access to my files). If you allow players to play with the wrong coloured sock tape you haven't accurately applied the laws of the game. If you said you hadn't seen it then I would also worry that you hadn't checked player equipment before the game, and if you don't check you don't know it is safe and therefore in accordance with law. If you said you had seen it then allowed it anyway then you are admitting that you selectively applied the laws of the game.

For me when I observe what I do with this depends on what level the referee is, and to a lesser extent what level the game is. I'm not going to mark down a level 7, but it will certainly be mentioned in the debrief and report. For a level 6 I'd be looking to see how he at least tries to deal with it. If he doesn't even notice it or try to deal with it I'd be asking him in the debrief why, and that may well affect the mark. I'd also be taking into account the competition, as not dealing with it Division 6 on Hackney Marshes (where all 11 players from team might not even have the same coloured socks on) is a lot different to not dealing with it on an intermediate league where the teams provide the kit. For 5-4 candidates I will always be marking down, after all if they get to that level they would be crucified for not dealing with it.
 
Had a match last weekend where i informed 2 players of a team they cannot wear black tape on red socks must be same colour, did not have any red tape so i said to them "Have you any clear sellotape?" (They did) so i told them to use that instead ..... problem solved.
 
When getting assessed, I always have to contact the assessor prior to the game. I don't know if this is standard practice but if it isn't it should be.
At this point, I'll always ask him/her about their thoughts on sock tape/under garmounts. Since doing this every assessor I've had at Sunday League level has said they're not overly interested however the one time I got assessed before I started doing this, it got picked up immediately on my pre-match. Maybe it was just by total coincident but I have the feeling that assessors are more interested in spotting such a pedantic infringement such as a sock tape rather than preventing at grass roots level.
 
BradTheRef said:
When getting assessed, I always have to contact the assessor prior to the game. I don't know if this is standard practice but if it isn't it should be.
At this point, I'll always ask him/her about their thoughts on sock tape/under garmounts. Since doing this every assessor I've had at Sunday League level has said they're not overly interested however the one time I got assessed before I started doing this, it got picked up immediately on my pre-match. Maybe it was just by total coincident but I have the feeling that assessors are more interested in spotting such a pedantic infringement such as a sock tape rather than preventing at grass roots level.
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Why ask an assessor this? This has been in LOTG for about 4 seasons now and players all know what's expected.
I do some assessing/observing myself and if I was asked this question I might ask which other laws I should be turning a blind eye to. Assessors are generally not out to get you they are there to help you progress so do yourself a favour and control the simple things.
I posted on here the other day saying I always carry a cheap selection of coloured tape. It isn't right I have to do it but it makes it easy to fully enforce the law with minimal fuss.
 
If I was asked that question by a candidate, I would simply tell them to referee to their normal standards and not change anything they do just because I am observing them........
 
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