A&H

Wolves v MU

Big Cat

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
Level 4 Referee
Pogba incident
Very interesting one because, the more times I watch it, the more I recognize the severity of the challenge
An obvious FT, but I'd argue it was more than that
I think it would make for very useful training material, because in hindsight, I believe it was SFP and a dismissal would've been justified
All the 'hall mark' signatures are there and that's why it could be used to educate Referees and players alike
Poor first touch, lunging in to recover for said touch, over the ball, studs showing, a ton of momentum, straight leg, the lot
Simply put, 'endangering the safety of an opponent'. Only by luck, was it a glancing blow that left Nevez's leg in one piece
Again, a player needs to simulate pain in order to get a decision, which fuels their diving antics

After a quiet Euros for VAR, I'm sick of it again only three games into the new EPL season
Five KMI refereeing mishaps in three Newcastle games all invoking VAR to decide the outcome of the games. Makes me echo the trend in the direction in my opinion over recent seasons. That is, the standard of Refereeing in the EPL is nowhere near good enough, meaning VAR is always in the thick of things
 
Last edited:
The Referee Store
I should add also, in isolation, I don't think this is a shocker by Mike Dean. He was simply too close to see the full picture
I do however, think it's another very difficult to swallow VAR moment because it's inexcusable to ignore the tackle with the benefit of replays

Also, none of the mistakes in the Newcastle games have been that poor in isolation. It's more the frequency of VAR involvement that acts as an indicator for the poor standards of Refereeing

Everyone likes the 'higher bar' thing and that aspect of the Euros is being perpetuated. But VAR can't be inconspicuous because it's always there, causing added controversy, because no intervention is just as bad as too much interference... all to often
 
How Dean fails to even award a free kick for that challenge is beyond belief, he's looking straight at it, and like said, straight leg, studs first and the momentum of the tackle. If the English official's are trying to let the game 'flow' because of how things were done at the Euro's.....they taken it the wrong way. European Refs were stopping the soft free kick's, when players were falling over at the slightest contact. They were not encouraging bad tackles returning to the game with the 'I got the ball ref' type challenges.

I had a game this morning where I was asked 'Why are you giving free kicks all the time, you're supposed to let the game flow now'
 
The first few replays I saw I couldn’t even see the contact in full speed but on the slow mo, he’s quite clearly made contact, stud to shin. I can forgive MD not giving that (he’s too close really but probably didn’t anticipate the bad touch), especially with Neves not reacting but VAR should be disallowing the goal.
 
I have to admit this is one that I have also changed my mind on after further rewatches. My initial reaction after seeing the replays was that the VAR was correct to not get involved, but having seen the other angle especially that one from behind when Pogba is coming towards the camera this is clearly a reckless tackle. I guess since it took me so long to recognize it I can see why the VAR did not as well. I truly love to know what pgmol tells its referees on this one.
 
This isn't a Red Card. The force is glancing in the way it catches the defender's shinpad.

The amount of force brings this down to a caution as per FIFA and UEFA directions.
 
AlexF said:
This isn't a Red Card. The force is glancing in the way it catches the defender's shinpad.

The amount of force brings this down to a caution as per FIFA and UEFA directions.
Click to expand...

The force doesn’t necessarily have to be excessive to be SFP, it just has to put the opponent at risk of injury and I’d say jumping into a challenge, studs up half way up the shin is endangering an opponent819C6948-8B38-42DC-A2B3-0A06526D756F.png
 
AlexF said:
This isn't a Red Card. The force is glancing in the way it catches the defender's shinpad.

The amount of force brings this down to a caution as per FIFA and UEFA directions.
Click to expand...

Well referees know that because we're properly trained on the considerations of a reckless tackle versus one that is serious foul play. Of course most fans and pundits only see studs exposed over the ball must be red card.
 
Big Cat said:
I should add also, in isolation, I don't think this is a shocker by Mike Dean. He was simply too close to see the full picture
I do however, think it's another very difficult to swallow VAR moment because it's inexcusable to ignore the tackle with the benefit of replays

Also, none of the mistakes in the Newcastle games have been that poor in isolation. It's more the frequency of VAR involvement that acts as an indicator for the poor standards of Refereeing

Everyone likes the 'higher bar' thing and that aspect of the Euros is being perpetuated. But VAR can't be inconspicuous because it's always there, causing added controversy, because no intervention is just as bad as too much interference... all to often
Click to expand...
What if the "higher bar" means players think they can get away with SFP? There are enough signs already that the leeway allowed in the Euros for mere contact not to be penalised is already being interpreted by PGMOL referees to allow "endangering" tackles.
 
st john said:
How Dean fails to even award a free kick for that challenge is beyond belief, he's looking straight at it, and like said, straight leg, studs first and the momentum of the tackle. If the English official's are trying to let the game 'flow' because of how things were done at the Euro's.....they taken it the wrong way. European Refs were stopping the soft free kick's, when players were falling over at the slightest contact. They were not encouraging bad tackles returning to the game with the 'I got the ball ref' type challenges.

I had a game this morning where I was asked 'Why are you giving free kicks all the time, you're supposed to let the game flow now'
Click to expand...
Ah yes, "the game was ruined by a referee who insisted on penalising every foul".
 
There's also data supporting that there are simply more kmis in a major top flight league then compared to the group stages of the Euros. Var will simply have more decisions to make which means var will have more controversial moments.
 
cwyeary said:
I have to admit this is one that I have also changed my mind on after further rewatches. My initial reaction after seeing the replays was that the VAR was correct to not get involved, but having seen the other angle especially that one from behind when Pogba is coming towards the camera this is clearly a reckless tackle. I guess since it took me so long to recognize it I can see why the VAR did not as well. I truly love to know what pgmol tells its referees on this one.
Click to expand...
We've had our differences in the past, but your post is very close to how I reviewed the incident
That's why I think this incident would make for valuable training material

Edit: I've taken other comments out because I was drifting off-topic
 
Last edited:
The penalty one is fascinating to me. This is 100% a foul literally anywhere else on the field and probably reckless. The odd thing is that wolves didn't even ask for it. Something about the cross getting played in and football not expecting it?
 
Absolute stonewall red card and a penalty for the disgraceful late challenge. Mike Dean and VAR missing the big decisions when it matters.
 
Pogba tackle is a foul, no doubt about that. I'd be going caution personally. I can understand why it was missed though, those 'glancing' hits are always annoying to identify anyway (for me). And in real time, on the TV, I didn't think anything major had happened.

I'm not sold that I'd give a penalty for the Dan James one though, slow motion is making it look worse than it is, but I'd not complain if it was given - just I don't think I'd be quick to give it.
 
It's an obvious pen and VAR should be all over that. Astounding that the TV people did not pick it up. Wolves were totally robbed.
In old money, we'd be all "it evens itself out over the season..." but VAR is meant to crack these two cases. Shocking.

Not unlike VVD's injury challenge BTW.
 
Another voice to the consensus here, the Pogba challenge is a textbook example of the kind of thing we've been discussing recently where contact on the ball doesn't stop it being reckless.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top