Deliberate pass back to keeper.

[matty639]

Had one to ponder this afternoon. Blue v red, blue right back has the ball near the side line about a third of the way up the pitch with a red attacker closing him down. He realises his lack ability and isn't going to beat his man so passes inside and back to his CB. He has though messed it up and ball is to powerful and CB misses it and if goes behind him, queue CB and another red attacker running after it. Keeper sees them thundering towards him and comes and jumps on the ball.

Reds then scream for pass back and my first instinct is to put my whistle to my mouth. I give myself a second to think and decide the RB was attempting to pass to his CB and not 'deliberately' to the keeper so not an IDFK. But the offside thread has put a thought in my head as the RB deliberately passed the ball, does his intended target make any difference? Had an attacker been in an offside position he would have been fine as the ball was deliberately played.

As is typical of this things blue immediately broke and scored just to make reds even happier with my decision lol.

 

[haywain]

I'd say that you have to judge it as you see it and, if you're happy that the ball was intended for the defender rather than the goalkeeper then there is no deliberate pass to the keeper.

similar thing happened in my game this week and, even though the keeper kicked it rather than picked it up, i had already decided that it wasn't deliberate

'in the referee's opinion' every time

 

[micky2001]

I feel I would be giving idfk every time (feel free to correct me). He deliberately meant to play the ball to a team mate, whether or not the keeper was the original target I feel isn't important. If you don't give it, what is to stop them deliberately passing toward a player who deliberately leaves it so it roles to the keeper, who wasn't the intended target and picks it. Possible caution for "deliberate trick"???

I'd be shouting "deliberate, don't pick it" to make sure everyone knows if I felt there was any possibility of a pass back.

 

[haywain]

a deliberate trick does involve touching the ball, micky, n'est-ce pas?

a deliberate pass to a team mate clearly isn't an offence

 

[micky2001]

If I feel it has been rehearsed or deliberately used I.e. Something they've practiced in order to circumvent the rules then I think it's possibly a yellow for USB. Still giving an idfk every time though, whether the keeper was the intended target or not.

I misread the LOTG there, I thought "deliberate trick" was that they deliberately tricked the referee. My bad

 

[haywain]

i'll give you a tenner the first time that happens during one of your matches, micky

i'll want video evidence, mind

 

[micky2001]

I'll hold you to that haha.

 

[SM]

It has to be a deliberate pass to the goal keeper. From your description you were correct to not give an idfk.

And of course then blue score, that is how Sod's law works!!

 

[HullRef]

Micky, you can't give an idfk if the player passes it back to a team mate because the law says it has to be deliberately played to the keeper. I agree with you that if it looks rehearsed then give an IDFK, just out of interest which player would you caution for that?

On other question (theoretical), if a defender passes the ball back to a team mate who flicks it up onto his head and heads it back to the keeper, what would you do?

 

[matty639]

Trust me this pass was not rehearsed, if it was then the reactions of his CBs were oscar worthy lol.

 

[haywain]

which could be a problem if the centre back was daniel day-lewis or jennifer lawrence

 

[Aled]

U12's keepers tend to ask me if they can pick the ball up, if they can I say yes else I say no.

 

[micky2001]

I agree with you that if it looks rehearsed then give an IDFK, just out of interest which player would you caution for that?

On other question (theoretical), if a defender passes the ball back to a team mate who flicks it up onto his head and heads it back to the keeper, what would you do?

I'd caution the defender since the keeper cannot be cautioned for a handling offence in his own box. I admit, the chances of it being rehersed are slim. If the defender deliberatly meant to pass it to a member of his own team and the keeper picked it, im always giving IDFK.

Second question, that would be a trick IMO.

 

[Matt Redmond]

But is it the defenders fault the GK picks it up? Its not the offence to pass it to him. It becomes the offence once he handles it. No cautions? What if the GK stops it on the goal line therefore DGSO??

 

[jertzee]

Interesting one. Seems to be split thoughts.
Personally I would not give a free kick. Keeper was not intended target.

I gave one the other week, U13 game. Left back in a left back(ish) position running towards his own goal trying to beat the forward to a hoofed attacking pass into space. Left footed the player kicks it across his penalty area (never recommended) and the keeper picks it up (keeper the only player in the box).
To me it is an obvious back pass, even though aimed across the pnealty area rather than at the keeeper in the goal area.

Manager disagrees but I explained later that a left footed player would normally kick it out with his left foot for a throw (8 yards away) rather than right footed across his area (20 yard pass).

 

[Mick.]

What if the GK stops it on the goal line therefore DGSO??

Not DOGSO IMO. A pass back is not an opportunity for the opposition to score, but an opportunity for an own goal to be conceded. I know its playing semantics but I could not see myself giving an IDFK and sending the GK off for stopping the ball from going in the net. If we did that because it's on the line why aren't we doing IG for every pass back when the keeper is in front of the goal. After all it is still only the goalie who is stopping the ball going in.

 

[haywain]

jertzee - please don't let me hear you saying 'back pass' again in this context

also, imho, i would think twice before telling a manager what a left footed player would normally do

mick - if i've understood your point correctly, dogso by deliberately handling the ball doesn't apply to a goalkeeper in his own penalty area - but i'm sure you knew that

 

[jertzee]

also, imho, i would think twice before telling a manager what a left footed player would normally do

I only explained this part of my reason to the manager, as I know the manager. I wouldn't do it to one who I had never met before.

 

[Aled]

But is it the defenders fault the GK picks it up? Its not the offence to pass it to him. It becomes the offence once he handles it. No cautions? What if the GK stops it on the goal line therefore DGSO??

No, GK can not be guilty of handball in his own penalty area. Therefore it's an IDFK and no more.