Runner Ref
Member
Thoughts?
Watford vs Sunderland
- Thread starter Runner Ref
- Start date
Thoughts?
santa sangria
RefChat Addict
Obvious?
Distance from goal?
Location of defenders?
I think the considerations help here. There is a lot to do before this is obvious and it is so far from goal. I think it has to be yellow.
Distance from goal?
Location of defenders?
I think the considerations help here. There is a lot to do before this is obvious and it is so far from goal. I think it has to be yellow.
Runner Ref
Member
Based on many of the comments, does football not expect red?
The Ginger Ref
Active Member
NoBased on many of the comments, does football not expect red?
Runner Ref
Member
Says who?
Plenty of the comments suggest red, as they think he's away if the handball doesn't happen. I personally think yellow, but football to some extent thinks red.
This is what I was saying about in the other thread, 'what football expects' is only used when it suits.
Only because people on social media like to criticise every referee decision. Had the referee shown red, I think there'd have been twice the number of comments (probably including some of the same people) posting that it's never a red, the referee's ruined the match, he doesn't understand the game etc. etc.Based on many of the comments, does football not expect red?
Obviously most people who agree with the decision aren't going to bother commenting on it to say so, so you can't assume that means that "football expects" what these naysayers are spouting.
Runner Ref
Member
I can't even answer that - maybe it should be done like Ask the Audience on Who Wants To Be A Millionaire? with everyone in the stadium having an app on their phone with multiple choice answers, the highest %age answer comes up on the big screen and the referee has to act accordingly?
Runner Ref
Member
We have something similar to that. It's called VAR. Only it's a lot less accurate than your ideaI can't even answer that - maybe it should be done like Ask the Audience on Who Wants To Be A Millionaire? with everyone in the stadium having an app on their phone with multiple choice answers, the highest %age answer comes up on the big screen and the referee has to act accordingly?
socal lurker
RefChat Addict
Really the only consideration in doubt is distance from goal. But, especially at the professional level, distance to goal has definite flexibility when the other considerations are clear. I don,t think any one would doubt that if the attacker targeted with the path was pulled down from behind it would be DOGSO in a professional game. While not officially a consideration, the blatantly cynical nature of the HB,in my view, makes red the proper call. The whole point of DOGSO being introduced was to remove cynical plays designed to prevent OGSOs—which is exactly what happened here. The targeted attacker has a clear one on one with the GK in the absence of the cynical play.
Too far from goal to expect red.
The Ginger Ref
Active Member
Because a red card would be incorrect in law due to the 4 considerations of DOGSO.
I actually don't disagree with your devils advocate, because it is horrendously cynical and the Watford player is likely to go on and have a GSO, however, as others have pointed out, it doesn't tick the distance to goal or the location and number of defenders consideration.
Even you have said yourself you think it is yellow, assuming you are a qualified referee, you have a better understanding of the LOTG than "football" who are effectively fans or rival fans on social media suggesting a decision is wrong because it didn't favour them.
Your reference to the other thread and 'what football expects' is because in the other thread the goalkeeper deliberately handles the ball outside the box, which in 99% of circumstances is considered a red card offence and has been since most fans can remember.
Runner Ref
Member
I'm more qualified than you'll ever know
Whilst I to a degree agree with what you're saying innthe goalkeeper one, most fans would see this as basically being 'last man'. Last man is seen in most scenarios to fans as being red.
I know there are maybe 2 defenders ever so slightly deeper, but they wouldn't be seen by a fan of being involved.
As I say, 'what football expects' is a kop out.
The Ginger Ref
Active Member
We could probably have this debate all night and not agree.
In my opinion, the LOTG don't allow for it and "football doesn't expect" a red card simply because of the distance to goal, there is still 56 yards of football to be played.
Watford fans may cry until the cows come home that it should be a red card, but they are not neutral.
In my opinion, the LOTG don't allow for it and "football doesn't expect" a red card simply because of the distance to goal, there is still 56 yards of football to be played.
Watford fans may cry until the cows come home that it should be a red card, but they are not neutral.
The foundation on which Refchat is based on!
To be fair I was there yesterday and thought it was curving towards the corner flag (and away from Martins) in real time, so I think yellow was the correct decision.
Funnily enough, my Sunderland supporting (non-referee) mate thought it was a red!
socal lurker
RefChat Addict
58’ athletic Bilbao- getafe DOGSO-H at midfield
Not much different . . . I think red is correct on both plays.
Russell Jones
RefChat Addict
The only 'requirement' for DOGSO is that the referee believes that the offence has denied an obvious goal scoring opportunity. The four considerations are just that ... things for a referee to consider before deciding whether it's an OGSO. In my opinion, at this skill level, the next touch of the ball will be by the yellow striker, around 30m from goal and he will then have a 1 on 1 with the keeper ... I'm calling that DOGSO. At lower levels of football, a yellow would definitely preferable because the obviousness of the GSO would decrease