I actually think it is after seeing replay from different angle. Not sure if it’s C and O tho, but poor from Oliver to give goal kick.I thought that was handball - hand moves towards the ball and it’s away from his body. Hard to argue C&O if everyone’s split on it though.
Caicedo could have had a second yellow there for me
That isn't what the law says though. At the time the ball hit his arm it was in a perfectly expected position for the footballing action being undertaken.I think it's a PK because his arm moved into the ball and it probably passes between his arm and body without the movement.
Agree on the law, but which footballing action - could you elaborate?That isn't what the law says though. At the time the ball hit his arm it was in a perfectly expected position for the footballing action being undertaken.
He had his arm on the shoulder of the person next to him in the wall, he then jumps and as he comes back down his hand falls towards his body, that to me is an entirely natural position. Had he left his arm out horizontal and the ball hit it then I would say penalty, or had his arm gone the other way, i.e. started by his body and come upwards, I would also say penalty. But I just don't see any intentional handling nor the arm not being in an unjustifiable position here.Agree on the law, but which footballing action - could you elaborate?
To me it looked like the wall had broken, the ball was travelling through the gap, and his hand instinctively moved down towards the ball to stop it. The three in the wall all jump and Grealish is the only one of them with his hand away from his body.
He had his arm on the shoulder of the person next to him in the wall, he then jumps and as he comes back down his hand falls towards his body, that to me is an entirely natural position. Had he left his arm out horizontal and the ball hit it then I would say penalty, or had his arm gone the other way, i.e. started by his body and come upwards, I would also say penalty. But I just don't see any intentional handling nor the arm not being in an unjustifiable position here.
That shot isn't anywhere near when the ball hits the arm though, by the time it hits it is down towards his side, and the contact is so minimal none of the match officials even see it.If we're gonna say a defender can have their arm on a teammates shoulder in the wall and then have their arm end up here taking away a massive gap in the wall then it sounds like a pretty good way to make the wall cover more space. How is okay for a stationary player in the wall?
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Why would it have been handball 15 years ago?I came on here expecting to join in with the entire forum calling this a penalty!
I'm very surprised that people are saying no pen. Have I missed some issued guidance?
That was a penalty 15 years ago so it's probably 3 penalties and a red card today.
These failures to sent The Guvnor to the VAR screen are starting to add up.
Why would it have been handball 15 years ago?
I don't think was a handball now and I don't think it would have been 15 years ago. He was jumping so his arms will come up, the arm hit the ball as it was coming back down, I just see that as a normal footballing action. I know some say that he knew the ball was going between him and the player next to him so moved his arm to the ball, but that would be a nigh on impossible reaction with the ball moving at that speedI was making the point that handball was given much less often back then (and I think this would still be given).
Totally agree. And I think the 'natural silhouette' idea that @The Ginger Ref mentions is misleading at best. There are dozens of 'natural silhouettes' depending on the body movement being undertaken. The classic 'arms by the side' is only relevant when players are standing completely still ... funnily enough, that's not a super common occurrence in a fast moving game!I don't think was a handball now and I don't think it would have been 15 years ago. He was jumping so his arms will come up, the arm hit the ball as it was coming back down, I just see that as a normal footballing action. I know some say that he knew the ball was going between him and the player next to him so moved his arm to the ball, but that would be a nigh on impossible reaction with the ball moving at that speed