A&H

Advantage before bringing back for a penalty.

M

Matthew Jones

New Member
I was refereeing a game on Sunday when the following incident took place.
Blue player running one on one into the right hand side of the red teams box. Red player attempts to tackle the blue player on the 18yard line and catches the player on the ankle. Another red player has made it back to cover the player who made the tackle.Blue rides the tackle and gets the shot off but it blazes wide. Definite foul so I point to the spot. Red Manager goes livid stating that I had played the advantage so you can’t go to the spot having played the advantage. Thoughts???.
 
The Referee Store
Do you think the tackle put the Blue player off his stride etc or was he perfectly balanced to get the shot away ?
 
You did exactly right. You really don't play advantage in the PA, you play "wait and see". Given the situation as you described it, as no real advantage accrued within a few seconds (and the only real advantage over a penalty would be an open goal) then calling it back for the penalty kick was spot on. Ignore the manager.
 
How long between the tackle and when you realised the shot is going wide (between when you saw the foul and when decided you are giving the penalty)?
 
Matthew Jones said:
Off balance definitely.
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Unless the advantage is so obvious that a player must score, I would blow for a penalty immediately. You can understand the anger of the side that committed the foul as it appears that the attacking team have had two bites of the cherry.
 
Obviously its another YHTBT but from my short time in the middle id say very very rarely would i play advantage in the penalty area unless someone has a free shot with nobody within five yards of him and bang central in front of the goal.
 
As per my asked questions it very much depends on the timing. If you wait a full three or four seconds before blowing the whistle, it's clear you are giving them two bites at the 🍒 and even if the first bite was off balance it is still over tipping the balance to the attacking side.
If it's the time it takes to bring the whistle from the hand next to your shorts to the mouth and blow it (Say one second or less) then the selling point is, you are going to give the pen anyway. If goal scored within that time then no need for the whistle.
 
that's why I don't like the current LOTG. Why not over tip the balance to the attacking side ? Why should the balance be tipped to the defence...by them committing a foul, putting a player off balance and seeing his shot go wide...without any punishment ?
 
It's about restoring balance. Shouldn't be tipped either side. That's why triple punishment was changed and if you are challenging for the ball, it's not a send off.
 
Matthew Jones said:
Off balance definitely.
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Then you didn't play advantage. There's a difference between 'waiting to see if he pulls something out of his posterior' and 'playing advantage'
Shot = Advantage is a common misconception. Even amongst referees.

The attacker should not be punished for doing the right thing (otherwise, we're just encouraging diving).
Just having a shot isn't advantage if, in taking the shot, they're still negatively affected by the foul. This can occur, not just by being off balance, but even by defenders/keeper being in a better position to block than they were before the foul.

In the PK, don't signal advantage - wait a moment if a shot is imminent, but unless it's a good shot and they're not affected by the foul, go back to the penalty.
HoofItYouDonkey said:
Unless the advantage is so obvious that a player must score, I would blow for a penalty immediately. You can understand the anger of the side that committed the foul as it appears that the attacking team have had two bites of the cherry.
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There's no sense in blowing the whistle as somebody is taking the shot. You're likely to cancel out a goal doing that.
 
If you really feel the need to play advantage in the penalty area, which is beyond risky, you certainly don't signal it. You should only be playing it if there is an incredibly good chance of scoring, and if that doesn't come off immediately just give the penalty.

And I speak from experience here. I played advantage in an FA Cup game on a challenge in the area then pulled it back and it still stands as the worse thing I've ever done. It killed my control of a game that I'd been in full control of up until that point, and almost certainly killed my chance of promotion that season.
 
There was a great example a few weeks ago, I think in a Europa game i watched, the striker was fouled, the ball rolled to his team mate, the ref signalled advantage and the strikers shot was blocked on line by defender, fortunatley for the ref it landed at another attackers foot and he scored.

You wont play advantage in the box once a season, maybe not even in your entire career so just consider it as a no go.

Give the pk and seconds later the team score, you can talk your way out of it
Play advantage and it does not work out, good luck talking your way out of it
 
I was slow on the whistle for a penalty shouted advantage and a goal was scored. It was the longest moment of my reffing career. Knowing I had made a huge rick just waiting for the player to miss. I would never do it again, I would now do late whistle rather than do that again.
 
Ciley Myrus said:
There was a great example a few weeks ago, I think in a Europa game i watched, the striker was fouled, the ball rolled to his team mate, the ref signalled advantage and the strikers shot was blocked on line by defender, fortunatley for the ref it landed at another attackers foot and he scored
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I do take your point ! and it's good advice. But, if the striker was in a better position to score (even with a defender on the line) than from the penalty spot I don't think it would be too difficult to explain away. Stopping for a spot kick would take away the flow of their possession and add more pressure than just completing the move.

If only it worked like Rugby, where you could just go back for the penalty after the miss.
 
The other way I would sell giving the pk over an advantage is, IF the play on advantage does not become a goal, as referee, as far as all and sundry are concerned, its not going to the strikers fault for missing even an open goal, it will be your fault as referee for not simply awarding the pk

I tried it a few weeks ago in a closed door game, striker was being held, then held then restrained in the 6 box, with ball at feet, I was begging him to break free as goal was empty, as poster above says, it feels like forever, eventually I had enough and blew..and yip, striker rolled ball into empty net !!! in a competive game, on reflection, I would be giving that pk instantly, kills everything stone dead.
 
BCMilan said:
...so you blew for a pen, even though the striker eventually rolled it into an empty net ?
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Yes, I held the whistle for what seemed like a month before saying, its now or never, spot kick it is. Nobody, not even the "scorer" raised an eyebrow. Might only be my opinion but when an offence happens in the box, I think nearly? everybody expects a pk to be awarded
No prizes for being too clever, simple, safe officiating.
 
Had a Futsal game a few weeks ago. Attacker one on one with keeper and defender following him close from behind. Keeper dives about 5m from goal as the attacker is trying to go around him. Keeper gets the ball, rebound off the keeper back to rebound off the attacker and its slowly rolling towards goal (it 2-3 second to get in goal). In the mean time the attacker has slowed down and the defender from behind runs into him and makes him trip/fall over the keeper. The only one on his foot is the defender with a fair chance of clearing the ball before it goes in as his momentum is taking him towards the ball. I blow the whistle almost immediately (I was anticipating a foul), everyone stops and the ball rolls in. Its a pen and a send off as had there not been a foul the attacker could have either shield the ball in or just kicked it in. (it was not a DOGSO-Y case but futsal doesn't have that anyway).

As soon as I show the red, the player says but the ball went in, I tell him after I blew the whistle and there is no option now. He leaves without too much arguing. On reflection, the much better decision would have been was to delayed the whistle and see what the defender does. Had he cleared it then its a pen and red. Had he let it in its a goal and yellow. Both these scenarios decisions would have been easy to sell.

In the context of the game what I did was acceptable from an advantage point of view, but for game control I clearly didn't consider the better option and this was proven in the five minutes I had left.
 
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