A&H

Junior/Youth Another example of why I don't trust CAR's....

M

Matthew

RefChat Addict
U11 game yesterday, pretty competitive but fair game.

2-1 to the away side going into injury time when the home side got a corner. Great corner right into the six yard box and the home defender nodded that ball in. 2-2 with pretty much the last kick of the game. I look up to see the away CAR (who also happened to be the manager) flagging furiously and screaming that the ball had gone out.

Being 9v9 on a smaller pitch, I was right in line and can say categorically that the ball didn't go out, not even close. Did he honestly think that I'd go with his flag, despite the fact that I was in line?

And with that, the two minutes of added time was up. I blew up as soon as they'd kicked off. The manager walked straight towards me, telling me that I had to go with his flag :rolleyes: and that we'd played too long. As it turns out, we'd played the two minutes of added time plus thirteen seconds (the time between the goal and kick off). He then turned and stomped away. Pathetic, petulant behaviour from a grown man who should know better.

He tried to cheat and decided to sulk because I didn't let him get away with it.
 
The Referee Store
How dare you not allow him to cheat.

I wonder if we'd have won another World Cup if in the last 10 years if coaches or managers, from the very bottom to the very top stopped taking the easy route of blaming the ref for a contentious goal instead of improving the players and stopping the mistakes that caused the ball to end up in the back of the onion bag.
 
Lads can we not class all CARs as cheats. I know a good few CARs who are honest as the day is long.

Some are cheats, some are football lovers and want a fair game. :D
 
SM said:
Lads can we not class all CARs as cheats. I know a good few CARs who are honest as the day is long.

Some are cheats, some are football lovers and want a fair game. :D
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In fairness I don't think either myself or @Matthew classed all CAR's as cheats, just the one on question....who blatantly tried to cheat?
 
In a CAR's defence, running the line isnt easy. Its so easy to get flag happy and make a wrong choice. Or have massively late calls. They are there essentially there trying to help in some way.

My approach is always the same, I will start the game trusting them 100% and how I treat their decisions is swayed by their first few calls. The first couple of offside calls, no matter how close, if I'm not sure they are totally wrong, I will go with totally. I'll act as though the attacking team even questioning it are talking utter rubbish. But you soon get an idea of how trustworthy they are. If I start to doubt their calls I'll position myself accordingly to double check any decisions they are making so I can over rule if need be.

I would still say the number of cheating CAR's is small, some might not be great, but often they are trying to do a job.
 
Out of interest, was the ball even on the line? Or was the CAR out of position?

I'll pretty much trust them for ball in/out and direction unless I'm certain otherwise. As the game goes on I get a measure of trust and work out how much 'certainty' I need to overrule them. In my prematch I always cover this, that it's not personal but just because I think I have a better view - and not to worry because I'm the one that's wearing it anyway.

What gets complicated is that in my league, CAR's do offside as well, so there's a big trust decision to make there. As much as possible I'll try to be in position to call it myself, but I generally have to have a fair amount of trust in them unless they've shown to be really bad. Haven't come across any cheating (had a few who have made some significant decisions against their team) that I could spot, though a few were incompetent.

Where I first refereed, we didn't use club AR's at all. No NAR? Then you're by yourself.
 
It's stories like these that leave me absolutely incredulous that some referees still choose to use CARs. Sure, most of them are probably fair and honest, and some of them may even be competent. But unless you know them all personally, you aren't going to know who you can trust and who you can't.

Do you guys actually choose to keep using CARs, or do you have leagues that force them on you?
 
Being an honest CAR is the second hardest job in footbal. Because nobody believes you.

The hardest job is the CAR pressed into duty as referee. You are harder on your own team with your decision making and everyone still thinks you are cheating. :)

I know fair CARs who get grief every week. They still do it because they love football.
Worst job in Football. No question.
 
CapnBloodbeard said:
Out of interest, was the ball even on the line? Or was the CAR out of position?.
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It was reasonably close (within 2/3 yards), but pretty clear that it hadn't gone. I make a point of getting on the line to check on the CAR every now and again, and this just happened to be one of those occasions. He was in a decent position, but I was 100% that it hadn't gone.
 
SM said:
Being an honest CAR is the second hardest job in footbal. Because nobody believes you.

The hardest job is the CAR pressed into duty as referee. You are harder on your own team with your decision making and everyone still thinks you are cheating. :)

I know fair CARs who get grief every week. They still do it because they love football.
Worst job in Football. No question.
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I know this feeling. Sometimes I'll wear my black rather than my coaches gear (with the excuse I've just come from a game or got one to middle afterwards), just to reinforce that (hopefully) I know what I'm doing. Not being harder on your own team when doing the middle for them (own team compensation bias - if that's a phrase) is a nightmare as well - how to get grief from your own team as well as the other team.
 
I'm surprised in many of the comments I've seen that you allow the CARs to do offside. I know this is probably league rules so its not your faults but I just can't believe they would allow this ? Of course you're going to get fair people who will be honest. But offsides are hard to call at the best of times so why leave it upto a fat man on the sidelines with a roll up in his mouth.
 
Hartlepool_ref said:
I'm surprised in many of the comments I've seen that you allow the CARs to do offside. I know this is probably league rules so its not your faults but I just can't believe they would allow this ? Of course you're going to get fair people who will be honest. But offsides are hard to call at the best of times so why leave it upto a fat man on the sidelines with a roll up in his mouth.
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This might be more applicable to OA/Vets football. The youth league I predominantly ref on (and within which my son plays), lots of the clubs/age groups have someone who volunteers (rather than being volunteered), and is their regular "lino". And don't often have a problem with CAR's not being honest - in fact, a manager that was doing his own line (as he couldn't get a parent to volunteer) flagged for his keeper handling outside of the area (perhaps that was just a way of getting his own back on his parents though).

I find treating CAR's with respect, and making them feel part of your team works wonders.
 
I've said it a few times and im totally with Hartlepool on this. In's and outs only please ill do everything else. Never in the memory of man are any of the CAR's keeping up with play to give any credible decisions. I know of one referee who doesn't even bother with flags anymore as he just doesn't see the point. Im not saying they don't in your leagues, just the ones round our way.
 
Hartlepool_ref said:
I'm surprised in many of the comments I've seen that you allow the CARs to do offside. I know this is probably league rules so its not your faults but I just can't believe they would allow this ? Of course you're going to get fair people who will be honest. But offsides are hard to call at the best of times so why leave it upto a fat man on the sidelines with a roll up in his mouth.
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You are right offside decisions are hard to call which is why it amazes me that some refs think they can call them all and not let CAR's help with them. The only way you can possibly call offsides (unless they are miles off) is by being in line with the second last defender, anywhere else on the FOP and you are guessing !
 
I ended up as a CAR yesterday morning at a friends game. And for 5 minutes towards the end of the game (it was 6-0) decided to see how hard it is to give decisions when you move along with the defence as CAR's do (I.e. Not side stepping) and it's certainly tricky to say the least. Although it may have looked a bit strange a lad a year younger than most of the players running the line in walking boots as though he was qualified ;):p
 
If I'm honest most club assistants are honest, useless and clueless but honest nonetheless. It's rare I have one that cheats on a regular basis. The majority can do in and out of play but when you look across the line for an offside they are nowhere near play!
 
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