A&H

Fines for u/18 u/16 games

O

Ori

Active Member
What’s people view on the fine system for yellow card and red cards?

If I give 2 yellows to a player, his parents have to cough up £62 which is a lot of money.

I’ve reffed games where every car in the car park was a Range Rover and literally don’t care how much the parents get fined, but I’ve also been to matches in certain areas, where the economic outlook is very different. Dads not even there for their kids, no one to run the line, and I know that a red card or even a booking can cause hardship on the family.

I’m not going to lie, but it does affect me.
 
A&H International
Steve Fall said:
You have no control over what a club fines its parents. Continue to ref the way you have been taught and don't let it worry you.
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It’s not the club that fines the parents. It’s the FA that fines the club and puts it to the parents.

I’m not arguing on I should continue the way I have been taught. I’m asking what people think of fines for junior clubs?
 
I can see where the moral dilemma might come from. But we aren’t responsible for the fines, and that shouldn’t come into your thinking. You need to act on what you see unfold in front of you - you will do yourself far more favours with cautions and sending offs than you will harm. And ultimately few are going to thank you for not doing so.

Some of the figures charged now do seem excessively high, but again these are set by County FAs and leagues depending on the offence (league rules rather than yellows and reds mind you). That’s outside of our control.

Moreover, when signing up to a team these are accepted as part of it. An individual clubs rules will cover these scenarios. Also remember that a youth player cannot be fined directly - that falls to the clubs.

Some may choose to pass on the fine all the time, others may exercise discretion and cover everything except violent conduct and OFFINABUS.

I know of clubs who charge an upfront fee at the start of the season rather than match day subs, and so all expenses including fines come out of this.
 
No I get that, but I’m maybe too sensitive. When a manger tells me he doesn’t know how many players he has because of parents lack of care and transport issues for single mums……tugs at the heart strings!

Of course I still ref it as I would normally.
 
A previous junior club that I coached at decided to underwrite all yellow card fines for all teams for this very reason. You'll find plenty of things that could affect you at grassroots junior level. Kids that wear different coloured socks to the rest of the team or boots with holes in, kids that are just unkempt and have no one on the sidelines watching them or cheering them on. Children whose behaviour is really challenging but the underlying reason for the behaviour would reveal more serious concerns or events. You need to be thick skinned to be a junior football referee but you also need a level of compassion and undertanding. I fully get where you are coming from and have had these conflicts too.
 
Not necessarily helpful but I benefit massively from my partner being in education when reffing youth and junior football. There's a lot of reasons why children react or act in certain ways and treating them like adults isn't the right call most of the time. If you ever do think some more insight would be beneficial then a teacher in your life or a coach who is also a teacher could be good to chat to about managing a group of children effectively.
 
Gamespoiler said:
A previous junior club that I coached at decided to underwrite all yellow card fines for all teams for this very reason. You'll find plenty of things that could affect you at grassroots junior level. Kids that wear different coloured socks to the rest of the team or boots with holes in, kids that are just unkempt and have no one on the sidelines watching them or cheering them on. Children whose behaviour is really challenging but the underlying reason for the behaviour would reveal more serious concerns or events. You need to be thick skinned to be a junior football referee but you also need a level of compassion and undertanding. I fully get where you are coming from and have had these conflicts too.
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Thanks. Really breaks my heart when I see kids neglected. Being poor is one thing, having parents who aren’t interested is another.

Then I look at my sons team where you have both parents at every match both home and away, and if they can’t make one half, they make it for the other.

Glad I’m not the only conflicted.
 
Ori said:
If I give 2 yellows to a player, his parents have to cough up £62 which is a lot of money.
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Someone has been telling you a naughty fib. The cost of a dismissal for two cautions is £35 - £15 admin fee plus £20 fine.
 
Ori said:
2 yellows plus the red ?
Also depends on the area?
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Ori said:
A dismissal depending on offence is £55 and a yellow is £12. £62
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It's the same all across the country. It's not two yellows and a red, it's a red for receiving a second caution. For any dismissal, there is a £15 admin fee, then there is a fine depending on the dismissal offence. Second caution or DOGSO - £20. OFFINABUS - £30. SFP/VC/spitting - £40.
 
I presume, this a little like schools can't legally charge parents for school trips, but always, or used to when my children were at school, add the rider "If sufficient funds are not received then the trip will not go ahead"

If Under 18 I think clubs can't legally enforce a fine, but can of course increase subs or decline/cancel a players registration if the parents/guardians do not pay the fines, if they wanted to.

The club my son played for never passed the fines on to the parents, not that my son ever got cautioned - true!
 
PinnerPaul said:
I presume, this a little like schools can't legally charge parents for school trips, but always, or used to when my children were at school, add the rider "If sufficient funds are not received then the trip will not go ahead"

If Under 18 I think clubs can't legally enforce a fine, but can of course increase subs or decline/cancel a players registration if the parents/guardians do not pay the fines, if they wanted to.

The club my son played for never passed the fines on to the parents, not that my son ever got cautioned - true!
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In my playing days as a youth I recall 2 cautions that were ever given out.

Once when my team mate deliberately handballed it. It was SPA so was correct.

And another time, I was on the receiving end of a crunching tackle, which most certainly ought to have been a red card.
 
JamesL said:
In my playing days as a youth I recall 2 cautions that were ever given out.

Once when my team mate deliberately handballed it. It was SPA so was correct.

And another time, I was on the receiving end of a crunching tackle, which most certainly ought to have been a red card.
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I saw and gave out a lot more than that. Used to be on the committee and treasurer was always complaining about fines - although I do think most were for missing/incomplete teamsheets, that sort of thing.

Obviously after I qualified I used to do my son's club quite a lot - even after he left. There was one team that had a few 'interesting players' in it.

Manager's last game - he was one of the nicest/mild mannered men you will ever meet. In this game I had to send off one of the interesting players and his Dad came at me after the game, luckily intercepted by one of the coaches - another nice man!

Poor manager was in tears at the end!

Glad I don't do many youth games at that level now!
 
I’m absolutely with you on this one and have taken some flak for voicing similar thoughts. I honestly think it’s disgusting to fine youth football. U16s should be cards only, miss games but no fines, it’s a money making exercise for local authorities.
A lot of refs are happy to issue red cards at any age group. Depends what type of person you want to be really. Lots Just say, Ref exactly to the laws, not your responsibility etc. it may not be but I know some of the kids I Ref might not have had breakfast that morning, might have just left a domestic violence situation. Of course this affects how they’re going to act and how I’m going to treat them.
 
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