Yampy
RefChat Addict
@CollinasErben Geht auch im deutschen Ligabetrieb. Gesehen bei Viktoria Köln - Hallescher FC pic.twitter.com/gxfMPZo4ac
And another.
It'll end in tears.
And another.
It'll end in tears.
If this had happened in open play I’m sure you would have given a FK, as would everyone else on here. I don’t see the difference personally, though I do accept how people are saying one is time wasting and the other isn’tFor those of you astounded by my question about where is the trick...I repeat where is it? Fhe keeper 'flicks' (your term) the ball to a defender, I prefer the word chip but this is just semantics, what actually happens is the keeper kicks the ball....no offence play on.
In open play back-pass can be repeated multiple time to waste time (waste 6 seconds over and over again once in possession). But when it happens from a restart, time wasting can't happen because once it's restarted and in the keeper's hand the most they can waste is 6 seconds which is insignificant. Yet "from a free kick" is explicitly mentioned in the circumvent clause (which means you can't do it even if the intent is not wasting time). The same reason for putting a FK in circumvent clause should apply to all restarts, TI, CK and now a previously not possible goal kick.
EDIT: Note: as "from a free kick" is included in circumvention, and a player can't touch the ball again after they have restarted, it simply implies more than one player can be involved in the trick and it is still not allowed.
I’d also add to that the law surrounding the backpass doesn’t specify its use for timewasting, so whether or not it was used for that doesn’t matter, it’s the process in which they get around it is the issue which is why, open or play or not, I’d view this as a trickBeen thinking about this overnight as regards the 'Spirit of the Game'
'Backpasses' to the GK hands were prohibited to speed up the game and avoid delaying tactics. Players sought to get round this by trickery so this then became outlawed. Now the change to the goal kick law has reopened the possibility of player + GK getting round the 'backpass' law in a new way (or at least made it WAY easier than when defenders needed to stay outside the area).
Now in the OP, the defending team did NOT use this new tactic as a way of materially delaying the game ... hence they did not offend the spirit of the 'backpass' law. This would be the argument for not penalising on this specific occasion. However, why this has driven such debate is that it has highlighted a loophole which easily could (and therefore almost certainly will) be used to delay games. It's for this reason that I reckon the simplest thing would be for IFAB to just advise that ALL plays of this type should be treated as trickery ...
You're correct. I was just trying to use the original intent of the introduction of these rules to get to a perspective on what the 'game would expect'.I’d also add to that the law surrounding the backpass doesn’t specify its use for timewasting, so whether or not it was used for that doesn’t matter, it’s the process in which they get around it is the issue which is why, open or play or not, I’d view this as a trick
I don't disagree with you. Just saying if the law clearly says you can't do it from a free kick, what makes any referee think you can do it from a goal kick, time wasting or not.Issue is that this can happen easily and repeatedly at EVERY goal kick so even if it only 'wastes' 10 seconds each time it will be obvious and irritating for opposition players and fans alike. That said, if it has the knock on implication of far stricter implementation of the 6 second rule then that would bring a smile to my face!
I would be absolutely gobsmacked if the IFAB did not confirm this is an offence.@CollinasErben Geht auch im deutschen Ligabetrieb. Gesehen bei Viktoria Köln - Hallescher FC pic.twitter.com/gxfMPZo4ac
And another.
It'll end in tears.
In open play back-pass can be repeated multiple time to waste time (waste 6 seconds over and over again once in possession). But when it happens from a restart, time wasting can't happen because once it's restarted and in the keeper's hand the most they can waste is 6 seconds which is insignificant. Yet "from a free kick" is explicitly mentioned in the circumvent clause (which means you can't do it even if the intent is not wasting time). The same reason for putting a FK in circumvent clause should apply to all restarts, TI, CK and now a previously not possible goal kick.
EDIT: Note: as "from a free kick" is included in circumvention, and a player can't touch the ball again after they have restarted, it simply implies more than one player can be involved in the trick and it is still not allowed.
I would be absolutely gobsmacked if the IFAB did not confirm this is an offence.
FYI official guidance from IFAB has been released and i've tried saving it in the resource section but no luck...copy and paste below...
To all national football associations
and confederations
Zurich, 2 August 2019
Law 16 – The Goal kick – clarifications
The changes to the Laws of the Game 2019/20 have proved successful as seen at the FIFA Women’s World Cup™, FIFA u20 World Cup™ and in confederation and national competitions. The changes to Law 16 – The Goal Kick have often led to the game being restarted quickly and positively but there are two situations which have generated questions from across the football world which we would like to clarify.
Goalkeeper ‘lifting’ the ball to a team mate who heads/chests it back to the goalkeeper
There has been much debate about whether, at a goal kick, the goalkeeper is permitted to ‘lift’ the ball to a team mate to head or chest it back to the goalkeeper to catch and then put into play. The views of technical and refereeing experts about whether this is within the ‘spirit’ of the Laws is divided so the matter will be discussed by The IFAB Technical Sub Committee. Until then, this practice should not be permitted nor should it be penalised - if it occurs the referee should order the goal kick to be re-taken (but no disciplinary action).
Opponent in the penalty area when a goal kick is taken
Law 16 requires all opponents to be outside the penalty area until the goal kick is taken and if an opponent remains inside or enters the penalty area before the kick is taken and plays, challenges or touches the ball, the goal kick is retaken.
However, Law 16 also applies the ‘quick’ free kick principles outlined in Law 13 Free Kicks – Offences and sanctions that if any opponents are in the penalty areas because they did not have time to leave, the referee allows play to continue.
In practical terms, this means that referees should manage goal kicks (and defending team free kicks in their own penalty area) in the same way as they manage free kicks:
· Unless the kick is taken quickly, opposing players should be required to be outside the penalty area and remain outside until the kick has been taken
· If the kick is taken quickly and an opponent genuinely did not have time to leave the penalty area, the opponent may not interfere with or prevent the taking of the kick but may intercept the ball once it is in play. This is allowed because the defending team, as at a quick free kick, tried to gain an advantage by taking the kick quickly and if this ‘goes wrong’ the Law is not there to ‘save’ them.
· Players who deliberately remain inside or enter the penalty area before the kick is taken should not gain an unfair advantage, even if the kick is taken quickly
If an opposing player commits an offence (as outlined above) the goal kick is retaken; there is no disciplinary sanction unless the offence occurs a number of times (persistent misconduct)
Referees are skilled at managing 9.15m at free kicks and they should apply these skills and principles to the management of goal kicks and defending team free kicks in their own penalty area.
We hope that these clarifications will be helpful in the application of Law 16 and would ask that you communicate them to your referees, participants and the media.
If any further clarifications are required, please e mail the Technical Director of The IFAB: David.Elleray@theifab.com
Best wishes
Where is that? I can't find it on the IFAB website.
Common sense prevails
Was sent this from my RDO.i was sent it from a friend so not sure!
No, what it means is that the decision makers have all been asked individually and there is no consensus as to whether or not it's an offence.So IFAB, the lawmakers, don't have a clue if the law permits this?