Sorry, there must be other threads on this but I can’t find them. If a player is in an offside position just inside the opponents half when a clearance is made, and he runs back 20 yards to collect the ball then he is offside - is the IFK taken from where he collects the ball, in his own half? I had this once and every player and coach told me I was wrong so just checking!
Offside in own half
- Thread starter Dave Ambrose
- Start date
Quick question on related position of offence:
Scenario - I'm AR and can see that red player is 2 yards inside the opposition half in an offside position as all blues bar keeper are on half way line or beyond. Ball is played long over the top and he runs 25 yards to get it. I know he will cause an offside offense from this unless another red comes up to get the ball.
My question is this: do I hold position from the halfway line then flag offside when he touches the ball. Or do I follow him back and flag when he touches it. I suspect the former but then if another red player runs up the pitch behind him I follow them as they have potential to play it without offence?
Would be grateful for any help
Scenario - I'm AR and can see that red player is 2 yards inside the opposition half in an offside position as all blues bar keeper are on half way line or beyond. Ball is played long over the top and he runs 25 yards to get it. I know he will cause an offside offense from this unless another red comes up to get the ball.
My question is this: do I hold position from the halfway line then flag offside when he touches the ball. Or do I follow him back and flag when he touches it. I suspect the former but then if another red player runs up the pitch behind him I follow them as they have potential to play it without offence?
Would be grateful for any help
socal lurker
RefChat Addict
First, the simple mechanics question: you stay with your offside line until there is an offense to flag. When the offense occurs, you raise the flag.
Second, look at the OS diagrams at the back of the book. If the OSP attacker is the only attacker pursuing the ball and likely to get it, you don't have to wait--we consider him to have interfered with play, even though he hasn't yet. (I think that is diagram 5, but didn't go back to check.) But if there is an onside attacker who also has the potential to get the ball, or the ball is likely to go out of play, we wait to see what happens. (There are diagrams for each of those scenarios as well.)
And keep in mind that for the past few years the FK is from where the involvement with play occurs, not where the player was when the teammate played the ball. So staying with the play usually puts you in the right spot to indicate the free kick. (There is not, so far as I know, official guidance on where the FK should be taken when we flag before actual involvement where the OSP player is likely to get the ball; common sense and common practice would be where the player was when we decide that the flag should be raised.)
Second, look at the OS diagrams at the back of the book. If the OSP attacker is the only attacker pursuing the ball and likely to get it, you don't have to wait--we consider him to have interfered with play, even though he hasn't yet. (I think that is diagram 5, but didn't go back to check.) But if there is an onside attacker who also has the potential to get the ball, or the ball is likely to go out of play, we wait to see what happens. (There are diagrams for each of those scenarios as well.)
And keep in mind that for the past few years the FK is from where the involvement with play occurs, not where the player was when the teammate played the ball. So staying with the play usually puts you in the right spot to indicate the free kick. (There is not, so far as I know, official guidance on where the FK should be taken when we flag before actual involvement where the OSP player is likely to get the ball; common sense and common practice would be where the player was when we decide that the flag should be raised.)
one
RefChat Addict
To add to above, the common accepted practice is not to go past the halfway line if the offence is in the player's own half. The referee (using eye contact with AR) should point to where the free kick should be taken.
Also, given that you should stay with the 2nd last defender, there seldom is a case of distance gap between where you raise the flag and where the IFK should be taken (when offender moves a long way past the 2ndLD to offend). In these cases, the advice is, if the gap is small, AR should just bring the flag down where he raised it for second O/S signal. For a big gap, move to the correct position (except for case in first paragraph) before giving the second signal, although the latter practice never happens.
Also, given that you should stay with the 2nd last defender, there seldom is a case of distance gap between where you raise the flag and where the IFK should be taken (when offender moves a long way past the 2ndLD to offend). In these cases, the advice is, if the gap is small, AR should just bring the flag down where he raised it for second O/S signal. For a big gap, move to the correct position (except for case in first paragraph) before giving the second signal, although the latter practice never happens.
Russell Jones
RefChat Addict
Indeed, I got picked up (as a minor development point) for NOT doing this in my last AR observation.
Player came back 10 metres from an offside position. I waited upfield (level with the second last defender) to see if he would play the ball. When he did, I gave offside where I was standing. Observer rightly commented that I should have then side stepped to the actual point of offence and re-signalled from there!
The second scenario was the one I emailed the IFAB on, because EPL ARs simply do not follow this explicit part of the law - and nor do most professional ARs. The IFAB suggested you sometimes can't teach old dogs new tricks! I was congratulated by the tutor (a FL AR) for doing the second scenario properly - i.e. where the infringement took place - but I noticed he didn't in one of the FL games I watched him in! The higher the AR, the more different the LOTG are. To it properly.
Wait, do we or do we not cross the halfway line?
It's fairly rare but when I've not crossed the halfway line I find most players take the kick in their own half as they never seem to realise they can push into the opposition half, so crossing the line would make it clearer surely?
It's fairly rare but when I've not crossed the halfway line I find most players take the kick in their own half as they never seem to realise they can push into the opposition half, so crossing the line would make it clearer surely?
Good practice is that you shouldn't, as the referee should be aware of where the actual offence took place and it looks really messy to get into the 'opposition' half.
socal lurker
RefChat Addict
I think it only "looks really messy" because people aren't used to it. I think it should be an acceptable practice to cross the mystical barrier to help set where the FK is, as the R will want to be getting up-field for the next phase of play. But I agree that the accepted practice still seems to not cross over.
Peter Grove
RefChat Addict
The recommended procedure in the official advice put out jointly by the PGMOL, the Premier League, Football League & FA is for the AR not to cross the half way line but to communicate with the referee who will then indicate the position of the kick. I don't see any good reason to go against that advice.
The wording from the actual communique goes (in part) as follows:
As well as it not being recommended, one potential problem I can see is if as in the OP, the kick is 20 yards into the player's own half (and it could be even more). If it is taken quickly and then play reverses back the other way, you could be hard put to get back into position in the other half for any new potential offside.
The wording from the actual communique goes (in part) as follows:
As well as it not being recommended, one potential problem I can see is if as in the OP, the kick is 20 yards into the player's own half (and it could be even more). If it is taken quickly and then play reverses back the other way, you could be hard put to get back into position in the other half for any new potential offside.
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Hi Peter, do you have a link to that resource please?
Peter Grove
RefChat Addict
I've posted it in the Resources section. If you download it and read it, you'll see it's intended primarily for referees at the upper levels, where headset communications devices are in use. However, I reckon the majority of what it says and the basic principles could still be used, even if you don't have electronic communications devices available to you.
Thank you.