A&H

Substitution ball in play

Z

Zimmyman

Well-Known Member
Ok under 13 game roll on roll off subs a real pain sometimes !!!! Yes ?
Right scenario on Sunday ! Offside given goalkeeper ready to take I have whistle in my mouth ready to start ! Manger calls ref sub !!
I wave play in and say when ball is next out of play ! He then says ball is out of play !
The thing is he could have subbed when I blew for offside and ball was being retrieved why wait till everyone is lined up and ready for the free kick to call it then question was I right??
 
The Referee Store
Chrisp72 said:
I would of allowed the sub you hadn’t blew so couldn’t see a problem with it
Click to expand...
I can see what you mean but I felt I have the right to decide when to allow the substitution as per LOTG the keeper was about to take the kick there had to be some joined up thinking on managers part when they see that situation
 
First things first. Take this with the best intention @Zimmyman . We are not there to boss them. It's not us vs them. Its not our rights vs their rights. We are there to facilitate the game but be as fair and impartial as possible. We have the laws of the game to help us do that. I am not saying this just for this thread. Your other threads which has had game incidents also sound as though you are taking a combative approach to the game. Take this as a constructive criticism and I hope it will help you in your future games.

As for the OP, it is within their right to request a substitution when the ball is out of play and expect the ref to give permission. It is also withing your rights to refuse it. The only time I would refuse subs is for fairness. That is when they use it to prevent a quick restart by the opponents (usually in a counter attack), or they are using it as a time wasting tactic (which often happens in roll on - roll off games). For the latter be mindful of not taking away their right to substitution altogether.
 
Chrisp72 said:
I would of allowed the sub you hadn’t blew so couldn’t see a problem with it
Click to expand...
It's would have

Zimmyman said:
Ok under 13 game roll on roll off subs a real pain sometimes !!!! Yes ?
Right scenario on Sunday ! Offside given goalkeeper ready to take I have whistle in my mouth ready to start ! Manger calls ref sub !!
I wave play in and say when ball is next out of play ! He then says ball is out of play !
The thing is he could have subbed when I blew for offside and ball was being retrieved why wait till everyone is lined up and ready for the free kick to call it then question was I right??
Click to expand...
I get the annoyance....but what's gained by delaying it further? The same time gets wasted when he does want a sub, but now you're frustrating the team.

I think @one had a good response.

Also, in the final minute or so of the half I start getting very deaf....but then again that's in games with no stoppage time.
If the keeper really was just about to kick - as in, was already running up - and had kicked it, then no - but if the keeper was waiting, then may as well go ahead.

Only other thing I can recall intervening in is when a team wants multiple subs, but one at a time. ie sub is complete, then tells me he wants a 2nd. Nope, all at once champ. He'll get it next out, but hopefully he gets the message moving forwards.

Cases like this it's just ignorance or not thinking rather than malice.

In your case, you could even have said with a smile next time you're running past the coach "Hey coach, with the subs, would you mind shouting for it when the ball goes out, not after the keeper fetches it and is about to take the kick? Just keeps the game flowing - appreciate your help!" Only needs to be a friendly word
 
  • Like
Reactions: one
CapnBloodbeard said:
Only other thing I can recall intervening in is when a team wants multiple subs, but one at a time. ie sub is complete, then tells me he wants a 2nd. Nope, all at once champ. He'll get it next out, but hopefully he gets the message moving forwards.
Click to expand...
Yep. A manager trying to do this is the only time I can remember refusing a sub, other than that they pretty much get to do it when they want..
 
one said:
First things first. Take this with the best intention @Zimmyman . We are not there to boss them. It's not us vs them. Its not our rights vs their rights. We are there to facilitate the game but be as fair and impartial as possible. We have the laws of the game to help us do that. I am not saying this just for this thread. Your other threads which has had game incidents also sound as though you are taking a combative approach to the game. Take this as a constructive criticism and I hope it will help you in your future games.

As for the OP, it is within their right to request a substitution when the ball is out of play and expect the ref to give permission. It is also withing your rights to refuse it. The only time I would refuse subs is for fairness. That is when they use it to prevent a quick restart by the opponents (usually in a counter attack), or they are using it as a time wasting tactic (which often happens in roll on - roll off games). For the latter be mindful of not taking away their right to substitution altogether.
Click to expand...
Thank you this is very helpful information for me to go forwards with and I have strongly taken this on board ! Combative is correct I understand but when I’m having a good game and I still have a manager giving me full grief I tend to think this makes one combative does it not ?
It seems that since starting my ref journey parents and coaches EVERY Sunday just spoil everything not only for me but themselves and particularly the boys ! But ONE thank you for the advice
 
  • Like
Reactions: one
It really annoys me not so much the making of subs at around this age group but the way its done, teams often make a sub during the second half literally every 3-4 minutes, surely easier for everyone to make two at once.
 
Zimmyman said:
Thank you this is very helpful information for me to go forwards with and I have strongly taken this on board ! Combative is correct I understand but when I’m having a good game and I still have a manager giving me full grief I tend to think this makes one combative does it not ?
It seems that since starting my ref journey parents and coaches EVERY Sunday just spoil everything not only for me but themselves and particularly the boys ! But ONE thank you for the advice
Click to expand...

I completely get your opening statement here and your right it can make you feel that way, but you cant let it. They are attacking the badge, the shirt, not you personally. Don't let them grind you down. Stay strong. You are the only person on that pitch who knows the laws and how to apply them.

As you climb the ladder you will get it more, they will try and sway your decision and undermine you. Sometimes you have to put a couple of extra layers of skin on before a game. Say what you want, i honestly couldn't care less!!
 
CapnBloodbeard said:
It's would have


I get the annoyance....but what's gained by delaying it further? The same time gets wasted when he does want a sub, but now you're frustrating the team.

I think @one had a good response.

Also, in the final minute or so of the half I start getting very deaf....but then again that's in games with no stoppage time.
If the keeper really was just about to kick - as in, was already running up - and had kicked it, then no - but if the keeper was waiting, then may as well go ahead.

Only other thing I can recall intervening in is when a team wants multiple subs, but one at a time. ie sub is complete, then tells me he wants a 2nd. Nope, all at once champ. He'll get it next out, but hopefully he gets the message moving forwards.

Cases like this it's just ignorance or not thinking rather than malice.

In your case, you could even have said with a smile next time you're running past the coach "Hey coach, with the subs, would you mind shouting for it when the ball goes out, not after the keeper fetches it and is about to take the kick? Just keeps the game flowing - appreciate your help!" Only needs to be a friendly word
Click to expand...
sorry @CapnBloodbeard it was poor of me your correct , I’m n lot that academic never have been I was just offering a bit of friendly advice . Just want to say thank you for correcting me I will remember my mistake and hopefully never make the same mistake again
 
Cheshire Ref said:
This is a refereeing forum not an English test, everybody knows exactly what @Chrisp72 meant.
Click to expand...
In this particular instance, probably but grammar is important in making sure your meaning is clearly understood.

As the saying goes: "Grammar - it's the difference between knowing your shìt and knowing you're shìt."

My other two favourite sayings about using words correctly are the following.
"The slovenliness of our language makes it easier for us to have foolish thoughts."
George Orwell

“An outer and visible sign of intellectual shoddiness is the inability to express ideas clearly and logically.”
Richard Mitchell
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top