A&H

Open Age Early booking

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Egg man

Member
Level 5 Referee
At my game at the weekend, Very early in the game the 2min an attacking player No9 fouled an Defending player No 5 the challenge was late and the defending player was not happy with the challenge. I had words with the attacker to calm the situation but no caution.

On the next attack the defending player No5 that had been foul took revenge for the challenge and recklessly fouled the attacking player No9 and was caution for the foul. looking back on it I should of booked the no 9 in the 2min this may stop the revenge challenge by the defender No5.

The game carried on in this manner the weather and the pitch did not help the game, it became very stop start as they argued over decision, I blew for every infringement I could, but in the end we ended up with two sin bins four caution and one sending off.

The commits at the final whistle your worst referee we had and the disrespect only two players shaking my hand, as players continued to argue as they left the pitch. Only the week before i had be observed and had good feedback so was disappointed to hear that comment.

Any tip or advice on these situations.

Thank you
 
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Egg man said:
At my game at the weekend, Very early in the game the 2min an attacking player No9 fouled an Defending player No 5 the challenge was late and the defending player was not happy with the challenge. I had words with the attacker to calm the situation but no caution.

On the next attack the defending player No5 that had been foul took revenge for the challenge and recklessly fouled the attacking player No9 and was caution for the foul. looking back on it I should of booked the no 9 in the 2min this may stop the revenge challenge by the defender No5.

The game carried on in this manner the weather and the pitch did not help the game, it became very stop start as they argued over decision, I blew for every infringement I could, but in the end we ended up with two sin bins four caution and one sending off.

The commits at the final whistle your worst referee we had and the disrespect only two players shaking my hand, as players continued to argue as they left the pitch. Only the week before i had be observed and had good feedback so was disappointed to hear that comment.

Any tip or advice on these situations.

Thank you
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I'm new too, literally 10 games under my belt, but it sounds like that early yellow was all you were missing.

I try to treat minute 1 and minute 90 the same but it is hard because deep down you don't want to be dishing out cards all the time.

If you do "bottle" that early card again, we've all done it, and the game is spiralling out of control then stop the game. Call the captains over and have a stern word that it needs to stop or players will be going off early at this rate. I find when I have done this, if I acknowledge that I haven't got it right every time then that honesty can help alot but it's a judgement call.
 
Egg man said:
At my game at the weekend, Very early in the game the 2min an attacking player No9 fouled an Defending player No 5 the challenge was late and the defending player was not happy with the challenge. I had words with the attacker to calm the situation but no caution.

On the next attack the defending player No5 that had been foul took revenge for the challenge and recklessly fouled the attacking player No9 and was caution for the foul. looking back on it I should of booked the no 9 in the 2min this may stop the revenge challenge by the defender No5.

The game carried on in this manner the weather and the pitch did not help the game, it became very stop start as they argued over decision, I blew for every infringement I could, but in the end we ended up with two sin bins four caution and one sending off.

The commits at the final whistle your worst referee we had and the disrespect only two players shaking my hand, as players continued to argue as they left the pitch. Only the week before i had be observed and had good feedback so was disappointed to hear that comment.

Any tip or advice on these situations.

Thank you
Click to expand...
If the first offence was reckless, a caution would have been correct. That sets the standard for the game, so if similar challenges occur further cautions are expected.
Unfortunately the players will appeal for every challenge after the first, but that's life.
 
Unfortunately it sounds like you missed the early opportunity to stamp your authority on the game.
That 2nd minute yellow card might seem early and you probably will get the old “it’s my first tackle ref!” but it sets the benchmark for the remaining 88mins and possibly prevents that revenge tackle.

The positive is that you’ve recognised that yourself and I doubt you’ll make the same mistake again!

I tend to work to the mantra of ‘manage the technical offences (within reason) but punish the physical offences’ whether than be 30 seconds in, 30 minutes in or in stoppage time.
 
Unfortunately by managing the foul in the 2nd minute has meant the defender felt aggrieved, so he's taken revenge himself. If the foul in the 2nd minute is reckless then it should be cautioned, and then if they carry on then it's their own fault. Unfortunately it's sort of expected that we won't caution early fouls, but sometimes you have to do just that. A nice early caution can really set the scene for you and can make the rest of the game easier, but it can also make it harder. You'll need to judge that for yourself on the day and react accordingly.

For example, I had two teams on sunday who really don't like each other. I had the same teams a few months ago. In the first game, the blue captain clattered an opponent after 30 seconds. I cautioned him, despite him saying "but it's my first one!" The rest of the game was quite easy - although there were a few cautions there was nothing stupid.
However, this time I didn't have the early one to set the scene, so the fouls gradually ramped up. In the end I had several cautions, two off and an assault by a spectator coming onto the pitch to boot an opposing player. I am generally pretty consistent and I said to the captains that they know what I'm like so they must manage their teams accordingly - unfortunately one of the captains was the first player off, for a jumping lunge through an opponent. I suppose in hindsight I may have over-reacted because as he said "but how else am I supposed to get the ball!!!" :)
I also had two players who were at it all game with each other. One was cautioned for a foul, and the other sent off for picking him up by the throat and throwing him head first onto the ground. Both teams agreed that was a harsh red!

If you are going to manage an early foul which should really be a caution then you really need to make sure the player knows he's walking a tightrope and give him a real bollocking, but the safest thing is to just give the caution.

As to the "you're the worst ref we've ever had" comment - you will be until the next game they play. Seriously don't worry about comments by players. They make these comments because they are upset and they don't mean anything. Besides which, they don't actually know the laws so aren't really competent judges of what makes a good referee. (And anyway, I'm the worst Referee! - at least according to half the teams I have. But then there's a reason why they get me, and it's not because they behave themselves!)
 
If the offence is a nailed on card, then you have to give it regardless of the time of the offence, scoreline etc.

The challenge comes when the offence is 'borderline' reckless and you can choose to either manage or card. This is a really fine line to balance as either way has both risk and reward.

If you go hard early, you can either set the tone, or end up with a whole pile of cards as you need to be consistent.

If you manage early, then you can sometimes get away with it, but you run the risk of having the players take the Mickey.

I'd say it's one of the hardest 'soft skills' in refereeing to learn, when to come down on the 'card' side of the line versus the 'manage' side of the line for marginal offences.
 
To be honest I didn't expect such an completive game, With the two teams being opposite end of the table. I think the pitch and the weather was a real leveller, It was a really scrappy game in the end, my first season as an referee and on the whole I'm pleased with how it has gone. But I just feel this game I was more active than I like to be due to missing the the early caution.

Two things i take from this
1. Don't manage reckless
2. League positions doesn't matter
 
I can only back up what other have said about cautioning a nailed on caution irrespective of time.
In an FA cup game I refereed, also a Derby, I decided to manage an early SPA. I But then the temperature of the game rose beyond being able to manage anything and I lost the opportunity to return that leniency to the other team.
2 things then happened, matey committed a yellow card challenge and rightly so the captain commented that he would have been off. I had to agree with him, but he accepted my explanation of managing the game and then the level of the game rising.
Then secondly, the 1 opportunity I did get to repay the leniency, matey then smashed the ball out the ground and got a 2nd yellow anyway... All avoided by not trying to be smart ass and manage what in any other game at any other time was a caution.
 
Its very difficult, neigh on impossible, to regain control of a game which you have lost.
Sadly it reads like your game was over after two mins, the players lost any faith in you to carry out your duty, so they took matters into their own hands.

If it means lessson learnt, then, some good has come from it.
 
Everybody’s points so far are valid. I’m going to take a different perspective.

In the spirit of being constructive, especially as other have said they too are new, picking up and cautioning the “revenge challenge” is a good thing.

You’ll see these from time to time. Sometimes in circumstances like this, but others where you think it isn’t a foul at all but the player is convinced it was, or he/she has been tormented by a particular player all game. This is slightly different to the “reducer”, or tactical foul.

Crack down on those and you’re in a better position going forward.

You also mention later on stopping for every infringement you could. In the circumstances, also the right thing. It suggests to me that despite the first snafu, you’ve switched from reactive to proactive. You cannot legislate for player behaviour. If they have moved to this mindset, frankly it’s in them. They are responsible for their own actions and behaviour at this stage. Sin bins and a red sound appropriate.

Ignore their comments afterwards. Sh*t happens. Learn from it - the good and the bad - move on and go again, and be better next time for the experience.
 
You say you should have booked the #9 to avoid the revenge from the #5, but ignore the revenge challenge - the #5 decided to make that challenge, not you. Was #9's challenge a caution that you let go because it was early in the game or only a caution because of the later challenge by #5?
As others have said, a caution is a caution regardless of when it occurs, but on the pitch your opinion is the only one that matters.

I reckon we have all been told at one time or another we are the worst referee a team has had in any particular season. Normally it comes from the team that under performs, looking for someone else to blame.
 
Egg man said:
At my game at the weekend, Very early in the game the 2min an attacking player No9 fouled an Defending player No 5 the challenge was late and the defending player was not happy with the challenge. I had words with the attacker to calm the situation but no caution.

On the next attack the defending player No5 that had been foul took revenge for the challenge and recklessly fouled the attacking player No9 and was caution for the foul. looking back on it I should of booked the no 9 in the 2min this may stop the revenge challenge by the defender No5.
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Firstly, you have already identified the incident which caused this and therefore, you will be more aware in the future. The old rule was "set the tome in the first 10 mins" and see what the players want to do seems to have drifted away. Why only comments was "did the No 5 see you having the words"? If he came for revenge, no problem with the caution.

Egg man said:
The game carried on in this manner the weather and the pitch did not help the game, it became very stop start as they argued over decision, I blew for every infringement I could, but in the end we ended up with two sin bins four caution and one sending off.
Click to expand...
I have the phase to "strangle the live out of a game". If the players was to be gits, then I use to referee "blade of grass" accurate for free-kick and throw-ins; and give everything. Players soon got bored of committing to me and attempting to foul the opponents. If they moaning hat I was ruining their game, it was "then play sensible, and I will adjust my style; if you keep being stupid, then this is what you will have for 90 minutes.

As for the worst referee, at least your are memorable, so when you are appointed to them again, they will realise what they are going to get. And they don't get to award the trophy for the worst referee of the season 😂
 
lincs22 said:
Firstly, you have already identified the incident which caused this and therefore, you will be more aware in the future. The old rule was "set the tome in the first 10 mins" and see what the players want to do seems to have drifted away. Why only comments was "did the No 5 see you having the words"? If he came for revenge, no problem with the caution.


I have the phase to "strangle the live out of a game". If the players was to be gits, then I use to referee "blade of grass" accurate for free-kick and throw-ins; and give everything. Players soon got bored of committing to me and attempting to foul the opponents. If they moaning hat I was ruining their game, it was "then play sensible, and I will adjust my style; if you keep being stupid, then this is what you will have for 90 minutes.

As for the worst referee, at least your are memorable, so when you are appointed to them again, they will realise what they are going to get. And they don't get to award the trophy for the worst referee of the season 😂
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Strange, I hear this advice all the time... it seems to be the accepted spiel in Ref circles. Yet, I've never 'killed' a game in this way. In my view, it would mess me up if I started giving a foul for the slightest contact. I can't really see how giving FT's for anything will regain any level of respect or control

Who knows, I may change my tune on this in the years to come. For now, I've not chosen to entertain such tactics
I have been in trouble in games. I had an assessed game earlier in the season which was going pear shaped. I turned it around in the last half an hour by having a stern word with myself to nail the rest of the game. By that, I don't mean I 'killed it'. Felt more like I 'hit a reset button'
 
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Big Cat said:
Strange, I hear this advice all the time... it seems to be the accepted spiel in Ref circles. Yet, I've never 'killed' a game in this way. In my view, it would mess me up if I started giving a foul for the slightest contact. I can't really see how giving FT's for anything will regain any level of respect or control

Who knows, I may change my tune on this in the years to come. For now, I've not chosen to entertain such tactics
I have been in trouble in games. I had an assessed game earlier in the season which was going pear shaped. I turned it around in the last half an by having a stern word with myself to nail the rest of the game. By that, I don't mean I 'killed it', I just fiercely knuckled down
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It's an interesting one. I have never been a fan of killing it in the first ten minutes as many referees say they are going to do, but equally if the players want to act like idiots at any point in the game then I will absolutely strangle the life out of it.

I think a lot of it is almost just what the referees think they are supposed to say in the pre-match instructions. I've worked with some who have given the first ten minutes spiel, then have played ridiculous advantages in the first five minutes.
 
RustyRef said:
It's an interesting one. I have never been a fan of killing it in the first ten minutes as many referees say they are going to do, but equally if the players want to act like idiots at any point in the game then I will absolutely strangle the life out of it.

I think a lot of it is almost just what the referees think they are supposed to say in the pre-match instructions. I've worked with some who have given the first ten minutes spiel, then have played ridiculous advantages in the first five minutes.
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Agreed. My first 10 minutes doesn't vary much from any other 10 minutes
Maybe the last 10 minutes is a bit different. That's when I step the effort & concentration level up a notch, but that's probably just out of fear rather than anything else!
 
Big Cat said:
Strange, I hear this advice all the time... it seems to be the accepted spiel in Ref circles. Yet, I've never 'killed' a game in this way. In my view, it would mess me up if I started giving a foul for the slightest contact. I can't really see how giving FT's for anything will regain any level of respect or control
Click to expand...
This means the players stop moaning at each other, or try to kick each other. They start moaning at you for all the free kicks. That is easier for you to control. It also stops stupid challenges going in.

If the game is going away from you, it is something the only choice.
 
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