A&H

Mmm satisfying!

P

puddles15

New Member
Had a pearler on Saturday - 30m in, gobby player leaves a very high lazy foot in a tackle albeit without aggression - easy caution.

As I call him over he starts shouting at an oppo player and calls him a tw*t which clearly upset the oppo (and me) so thought, he can have one for that too.

Writing down the details before carding, he says ‘you’ve been soft all game ref’. I show him the first yellow and he walks away, so call him back and say, ‘not done yet mate, you can have another one for calling him a tw*t and this too - you’re dismissed’.

By FAR the most satisfying 5 seconds of my refereeing career so far.

Keen to hear any other stories of satisfaction!
 
The Referee Store
Not entirely the same result. It’s not could’ve been offinabus, it is offinabus and is a straight red rather than second yellow. Sounds pedantic I know
 
In my (albeit limited) experience, especially if this is earlier in the game, you're setting yourself up for "ref he just called me a ****" for the rest of the game as that's the baseline that's been set for a bookable offence. Players may not know the rules but they do see it when a sanction is given for something that isn't given for the same something at another time - especially when it's with words as you can almost always dismiss challenges as different if you want to.

Do you think it might've been better to issue a dissent caution instead of the second caution and bin him for 8-10? I'd be interested to know what it was like for the remainder of the game, if any further issues occurred or this was the end of it. I know that there's a current thread about the effectiveness of sin binning and how two yellows should always be a red, but in this instance you'd be:

1) Giving him a second fine,
2) Making it clear that you were just going to book him, but he had to get the extra word in to get a spell on the sidelines,
3) Probably making your life easier with other players as you're giving him a way back into the game rather than just making the problem go away.

Obviously this all hugely depends on context we don't have access to, but just my two cents.
 
ChrisBLD said:
In my (albeit limited) experience, especially if this is earlier in the game, you're setting yourself up for "ref he just called me a ****" for the rest of the game as that's the baseline that's been set for a bookable offence. Players may not know the rules but they do see it when a sanction is given for something that isn't given for the same something at another time - especially when it's with words as you can almost always dismiss challenges as different if you want to.

Do you think it might've been better to issue a dissent caution instead of the second caution and bin him for 8-10? I'd be interested to know what it was like for the remainder of the game, if any further issues occurred or this was the end of it. I know that there's a current thread about the effectiveness of sin binning and how two yellows should always be a red, but in this instance you'd be:

1) Giving him a second fine,
2) Making it clear that you were just going to book him, but he had to get the extra word in to get a spell on the sidelines,
3) Probably making your life easier with other players as you're giving him a way back into the game rather than just making the problem go away.

Obviously this all hugely depends on context we don't have access to, but just my two cents.
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You can't use the sin bin for anything other than dissent.
Dissent can only be committed against a match official by it's very definition found in the glossary of the LOTG.
 
JamesL said:
You can't use the sin bin for anything other than dissent.
Dissent can only be committed against a match official by it's very definition found in the glossary of the LOTG.
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DazN said:
Where was the dissent?
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I was arguing that instead of cautioning for the tw*t comment, he caution for dissent for "you've been soft all game ref" comment. It's not specific to any foul or incident but it is generally dissenting with the referee's management of the game no? I re-read my initial post and see that I didn't make that distinction clear, my apologies.

DazN said:
There isn't a fine for a Sin Bin
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TIL, I now have more sympathy for the opposition to sin-bins with that revelation. No wonder C1 AA is being used more instead.
 
ChrisBLD said:
I was arguing that instead of cautioning for the tw*t comment, he caution for dissent for "you've been soft all game ref" comment. It's not specific to any foul or incident but it is generally dissenting with the referee's management of the game no? I re-read my initial post and see that I didn't make that distinction clear, my apologies.
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Ah ok I see what you meant now! Having said that, unless it was said for everyone's benefit (ie shouted) or with any aggression I'm probably not issuing a sin-bin for that.
 
RefereeX said:
If you go sending people off every time they call another player a tw*t you're gonna cause yourself more problems than you solve.
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I agree. The point I was making is if you are deciding on disciplinary action because a player has called someone a ****, it can only be a red card.
 
Gamespoiler said:
I agree. The point I was making is if you are deciding on disciplinary action because a player has called someone a ****, it can only be a red card.
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What happens if the non-offending player doesn't react, so is unlikely to have been offended, but you deem the offending players attitude to be aggressive?
 
Gamespoiler said:
I agree. The point I was making is if you are deciding on disciplinary action because a player has called someone a ****, it can only be a red card.
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Disagree. That might have been the case when it used to be foul and abusive language, but the current law allows the referee to make a decision.
 
Interesting perspectives - to clarify, I’m quite happy with the process I went through - 2nd yellow for AA, esp as it was shouted at another player right in front of me. For me, I wouldn’t be dismissing if it’d been more discreet/in passing - my bar is a little higher.

I felt he had to go as I was offended enough, and not dismissing him would’ve likely set the precedent of ‘we can say what we like then’ - esp as I’ve already warned in my pre match chat that ‘offinabus’ language is likely to spell trouble.

I personally put a lot of emphasis on tone of what’s said rather than just the words. An besides, this player was particularly grating and he made it easy 😉
 
puddles15 said:
Interesting perspectives - to clarify, I’m quite happy with the process I went through - 2nd yellow for AA, esp as it was shouted at another player right in front of me. For me, I wouldn’t be dismissing if it’d been more discreet/in passing - my bar is a little higher.

I felt he had to go as I was offended enough, and not dismissing him would’ve likely set the precedent of ‘we can say what we like then’ - esp as I’ve already warned in my pre match chat that ‘offinabus’ language is likely to spell trouble.

I personally put a lot of emphasis on tone of what’s said rather than just the words. An besides, this player was particularly grating and he made it easy 😉
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Be careful of words you use though, as if you were offended by his comments that makes it a straight red card rather than a second caution. Doesn't cause a problem with the red card reports any more as we don't have to write what was said, but if you ever go in for promotion it could cause you issues with observers. If the observer asked you what the second caution was for an you said offensive language he's going to say that should have been a red card. I've had several times when I've asked what a red card was for and the referee has told me the challenge was reckless, and that immediately becomes a problem as a reckless challenge, by definition, is a caution not a red card.
 
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