A&H

Sheffield United v BHA

Jorik0907

Well-Known Member
Lundstrom red, absolutely agree with it. At the same time, don't think I'd have seen/given it on my pitch. Nor am I too sure lower level players expect a red here.
 
The Referee Store
100% red. It seemed the classic case of a player lunging for a ball they couldn't get to. I was amazed Peter Bankes showed a yellow card at first.
 
Banks knew it was Red, but left it to the VAR to upgrade. Fairly typical of how these incidents are refereed by the VAR
I smashed into 1.8 (Brighton) before the review and arbitraged out at 1.5; once the red came out. Free money!
 
100% red. It seemed the classic case of a player lunging for a ball they couldn't get to. I was amazed Peter Bankes showed a yellow card at first.
I have a feeling refs will reach for a yellow more frequently for challenges like that knowing that VAR is there to help. They might think it’s better to issue a yellow and change to a red, than show the red and try and get a player back on the pitch after they’ve walked off when it’s reversed
 
The goal, the lead up to it...
The first of 2 offside looks. The first one looks off.
I think the first one was definitively off. Seems the VAR chose not to go that far back
Edit: the first one looks really tight on replay :oops:
 
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I think the first one was definitively off. Seems the VAR chose not to go that far back
Edit: the first one looks really tight on replay :oops:

They showed the lines later on, Solly March on the near side played the attackers onside both times.
 
I have a feeling refs will reach for a yellow more frequently for challenges like that knowing that VAR is there to help. They might think it’s better to issue a yellow and change to a red, than show the red and try and get a player back on the pitch after they’ve walked off when it’s reversed
Exact same thing again WBA V AST
Not a 'clear & obvious' error by Atkinson, but very clearly the new way of refereeing. Obvious to everyone
Not quite sure why there wasn't a second red. We'll have to VAR review it ourselves when the replays are forthcoming
Edit replays showing caution was ok for 2nd incident
 
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Exact same thing again WBA V AST
Not a 'clear & obvious' error by Atkinson, but very clearly the new way of refereeing. Obvious to everyone
Not quite sure why there wasn't a second red. We'll have to VAR review it ourselves when the replays are forthcoming

In fairness to Atkinson this one was much harder to see real time. This is what VAR is for, and they are gradually starting to use it correctly. Hause's could have been a red card but it was a lot less clear than Livermore's, the former was a slightly mistimed play for the ball, the latter a wild lunge that I personally think had a lot of intent in it.
 
In fairness to Atkinson this one was much harder to see real time. This is what VAR is for, and they are gradually starting to use it correctly. Hause's could have been a red card but it was a lot less clear than Livermore's, the former was a slightly mistimed play for the ball, the latter a wild lunge that I personally think had a lot of intent in it.
Just commentating on the trend of showing (literally) caution and then leaving possible SFP/VC to the VAR
More frequent than not. Amounts to an evolving form of re-refereeing
 
Just commentating on the trend of showing (literally) caution and then leaving possible SFP/VC to the VAR
More frequent than not. Amounts to an evolving form of re-refereeing
I got two theories on this.

It's either what you say, it's referees just relying on the VAR to bail them out and taking the cautious route or referees are under too much pressure to keep 11V11 by the PGMOL and pundits alike and that it has to be so obvious a red to send people off. I still remember the Newcastle Brighton game and Kevin Friend had the most perfect view and yet he thought initially it was only a yellow card despite the Brighton player nearly taking the head off the Newcastle player with his studs by trying to do a flick and failing. Does not help when the pundits thought it was only a yellow despite it being an obvious red card for SFP.
 
I got two theories on this.

It's either what you say, it's referees just relying on the VAR to bail them out and taking the cautious route or referees are under too much pressure to keep 11V11 by the PGMOL and pundits alike and that it has to be so obvious a red to send people off. I still remember the Newcastle Brighton game and Kevin Friend had the most perfect view and yet he thought initially it was only a yellow card despite the Brighton player nearly taking the head off the Newcastle player with his studs by trying to do a flick and failing. Does not help when the pundits thought it was only a yellow despite it being an obvious red card for SFP.
Both theories should be redefined as FACT!
 
More VARSE - we were assured VAR would not mean re-refereeing the game.

But this SHU red and tonight's WBA red were both re-refereeing by a ref who clearly saw the whole incident with a great view.

Yes, they had great views but they came to the incorrect outcome in law. I don't think anyone is arguing they were red card challenges, so for me this is where VAR is working well.
 
Yes, they had great views but they came to the incorrect outcome in law. I don't think anyone is arguing they were red card challenges, so for me this is where VAR is working well.
I disagree. Referees are giving yellow cards because they can re-referee the game. It's rubbish.

I've watched more football this week than in the last 10 weeks and VAR is sh*te. Every goal is rubbish. The offside decisions are rubbish. The missing handballs are rubbish. The re-refereeing cards are rubbish. It's a steaming t**d. It's benefiting the news cycle. It's rubbish for referees and football.
 
I disagree. Referees are giving yellow cards because they can re-referee the game. It's rubbish.

I've watched more football this week than in the last 10 weeks and VAR is sh*te. Every goal is rubbish. The offside decisions are rubbish. The missing handballs are rubbish. The re-refereeing cards are rubbish. It's a steaming t**d. It's benefiting the news cycle. It's rubbish for referees and football.

That isn't right. If a referee says yellow and VAR review subsequently says red, they will get an incorrect KMI as part of their observation, that's my understanding anyway. So no referee should be willingly take the safety first approach as they will still be marked down if VAR then rescues them.

VAR is going nowhere, we all just need to get used to it.
 
I just looked at Dale Johnsons twitter page and apparently that is the 10th red card review already this season where a yellow was upgraded to a red so in theory 10 potential howlers the referees would of made without VAR. That's not good.

To put it in comparison, in reply to Dale's tweet, in the Bundesliga there has only been one overturn of a yellow to a red and only 9 all last season so even when you factor in less games, that is much lower than the PL.

I just seen the Sheff Utd sending off and Peter Bankes had the perfect view of it, it's hard to understand why he did not see that as a red right away.
 
How many reds have we had downgraded to yellow? Either way it's not good. I have no doubt VAR is impacting the original refereeing decisions. If we don't accept that then either VAR is making bad decisions or referees in PL are low standard to start with. Maybe all of the above.
 
How many reds have we had downgraded to yellow? Either way it's not good. I have no doubt VAR is impacting the original refereeing decisions. If we don't accept that then either VAR is making bad decisions or referees in PL are low standard to start with. Maybe all of the above.
I think we have to give some serious thought to the idea of our top referees not being as good as we would like - and doubly so when it comes to asking them to act as VAR's. Although "they're just not good enough collectively" isn't exactly a solution, it does help paint the VAR debate in a different light.

10 "Clear and Obviously missed" red cards already this season is disgraceful and needs to be addressed as such, regardless of the fact VAR managed to step in an rescue them.
 
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