A&H

The lone ref and offside

SM

SM

The avuncular one
last 5 games I have been at (1 in the middle, 4 as spectator due to Achilles' tendon issue) and a player has ended up being sent off for abusing match official following an offside decision not given.

95% of all dissatisfaction with ref decisions seems to be around offside/over ruling CAR/going with CAR.

Notable that there were games where an offside decision caused an obvious downturn in behaviour and attitude from players/spectators etc in an otherwise calm game (prior to a later sending off).

Van Basten may have had a point. :)
 
The Referee Store
The hardest bit of the job too. You get 1 look.and if you just happe to be a yard off out of position you can easily get it wrong when in fact to you it looks obvious. It doesnt explain player behaviour. At the end of the day its not our fault they are playing at a standard that doesnt require NARs.
 
My last game; despite warnings around offside pregame about them playing to the whistle and not the car and to think seriously about the sense of playing a high offside line without nars, they play a high offside line (close to half way line) and an opponent springs the trap and runs through and scores while 4 defenders stand with hands in the air 40 yards down pitch (literally me, the goal scorer and the goal keeper anywhere near play).

The car is about 20 yards closer to the goal than the second last defender when the ball is played through. The run looks pretty great to me, it would have been close but looked good to my eyes. The guy playing the pass and the man making the run are on my right side and I can see both players while running forward - which always helps when trying to judge offside, so I am happy. Goal results. The otherwise good spirited yet competitive games atmosphere obviously nose dives.

Defender ends up being sent off for OFFINABUS. The car at half time has a moan, so I ask him to tell me what he saw. He described the attacker being less than a half yard offside - but in his mind, offside. Mentioned to him that he was about 20 yards away from being in line with second last defender and that being even a yard off the second last defender can cause you to have a view which doesn't give a true picture of whether there was an offside or not when it is really close. And even then, you have players moving at high pace, so trying to judge where the runner is in terms of position compared to the second last defender when the ball is actually played is a difficult skill for even an experienced NAR when it is really close (see sky sports live games for evidence of this!). I mention that the whole incident plays out right in front of me, so my view was good and I was happy.

Deaf ears. I have ruined yet another game of football. :smoke:

Over the past 6 years, this is not an unfamiliar tale.
 
My game today: had to explain over and over again. If you try to play the ball and completely mess it up and the attacker is in an offside but not challenging for it; if he gets it is not offside. You are a lousy player that's all. No ref, you are wrong. You don't know the rules. Meh.... the coach was a gentleman though, while disagreeing at the the time; full time asked me about explanation seeing the attacker was about 10 yards off. As I explained it again and offered to show him the LOTG. He was happy with that and said I'll have your word for it.

But back to our topic, up here north we don't even use the CAR for offsides just the ins and outs and that's shambolic enough on its on. So you can imagine the chaos any decision given might cause sometimes!!!
 
You know my thoughts on CARs and offside...

That said, better a dodgy offside and deflecting the blame to the CAR, than a match changing goal followed by raging players, red cards and loss of match control. Unless you are much better placed than the CAR, accept their flag and blame them for the offside.
 
Generally speaking if I have an assistant, I won't give an offside without their flag. If they flag, then I've got a decision to make. And I definitely don't tell them this, or the flag will be going up for everything!

I've only VERY recently started clarifying to them pre-match that I'm much more likely to go with their decision if they're in line with play - so far in the 2 matches I've said this, the CAR's do seem to have been putting in the effort, but that could just be coincidence on such a small sample.
 
The first area I refereed in, we didn't use CAR'S. So, often I'd be by myself. Then I went to an area without CAR's.
With CAR's, I try to go 'end to end' a bit more, position myself...not quite the same as I do without CAR's, but it depends on their performance. Critical areas - free kicks around the PA, corners etc, I'll position myself like they're not even there (FK especially I'll stand on the offside line, even though it does compromise my ability to see other things). General play....well, I'll get a read from their competence and decide how much I trust them from there.

Sometimes getting wide can help spot offsides. Sometimes I find 'scanning' my eyes left to right on the grass helps me imagine a line and I can spot offside that way.

Some types are very difficult to spot by yourself, especially if the defender is on the left and the attacker on the right!

You do need to be constantly looking upfield though.

offside is impossible to get 100% right even with AR's, let alone without.
 
It always amazes me, at all levels of football, from Sunday pub league to Premier League, why defenders don't spend time defending rather than standing still with one of their arms in the air. I'm pretty sure that we taught our players from U6 upwards to "play to the whistle".
In my experience, if you're over-riding a CAR on offside, be vocal very quickly that is what you're doing.
 
SM said:
The car at half time has a moan, so I ask him to tell me what he saw. He described the attacker being less than a half yard offside - but in his mind, offside.
Click to expand...

He's almost certainly wrong.

In the premiership where you have excellent video angles and can make reliable retrospective judgements of offside calls, 80% of incorrect decisions are offsides given where the player was not in an offside position. Only 20% are offsides not given when they should have been.

The reason for this is a perception issue called the flash-lag effect. In summary, moving objects are perceived to be slightly ahead of their actual position. So even if you are a perfectly positioned experienced NAR very close offside decisions are very hard. I'll post a new thread with an offside quiz and more info later. In the meantime, here is an example of an offside decision not given which looks all sorts of wrong but was later shown to be correct.

 
Trip said:
He's almost certainly wrong.

In the premiership where you have excellent video angles and can make reliable retrospective judgements of offside calls, 80% of incorrect decisions are offsides given where the player was not in an offside position. Only 20% are offsides not given when they should have been.

The reason for this is a perception issue called the flash-lag effect. In summary, moving objects are perceived to be slightly ahead of their actual position. So even if you are a perfectly positioned experienced NAR very close offside decisions are very hard. I'll post a new thread with an offside quiz and more info later. In the meantime, here is an example of an offside decision not given which looks all sorts of wrong but was later shown to be correct.

Click to expand...
I couldn't remember the flash lag name!!! That is exactly where my post was trying to go!
 
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