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I don't think you can give a penalty for that unless there is a law change to say that you can't jump with your arms raised. All Lovren has done is jumped to head the ball, and his arm motion was completely natural in that process. He had no idea the attacker was anywhere close to him. VAR is supposed to have a low profile and not re-referee the game, I don't think this should be classed as a clear and obvious error as there is no way that would ever be given without VAR. There weren't even any appeals from Czech players, and what has happened here is what we always say shouldn't happen, the match officials have shocked everyone as not a single person was expecting a penalty.

I don't blame the referee though as in UEFA sanctioned games if a referee is sent to look at the screen they almost always go with the VAR recommendation, it is extremely rare that they stick with their decision and I get the impression they are told they must not.
 
The Referee Store
socal lurker said:
VAR would have checked regardless, as they check every potential penalty. With the collision, the VAR was going to look at it. Perhaps it doesn't get sent down without the blood making it obvious, but I'm not convinced.
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I’m aware they check everything but they wouldn’t have involved themselves in the decision without the blood in my opinion.
 
RustyRef said:
I don't think you can give a penalty for that unless there is a law change to say that you can't jump with your arms raised. All Lovren has done is jumped to head the ball, and his arm motion was completely natural in that process. He had no idea the attacker was anywhere close to him. VAR is supposed to have a low profile and not re-referee the game, I don't think this should be classed as a clear and obvious error as there is no way that would ever be given without VAR. There weren't even any appeals from Czech players, and what has happened here is what we always say shouldn't happen, the match officials have shocked everyone as not a single person was expecting a penalty.

I don't blame the referee though as in UEFA sanctioned games if a referee is sent to look at the screen they almost always go with the VAR recommendation, it is extremely rare that they stick with their decision and I get the impression they are told they must not.
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I agree entirely. It was a completely natural jump.
 
RustyRef said:
I don't think you can give a penalty for that unless there is a law change to say that you can't jump with your arms raised. All Lovren has done is jumped to head the ball, and his arm motion was completely natural in that process. He had no idea the attacker was anywhere close to him. VAR is supposed to have a low profile and not re-referee the game, I don't think this should be classed as a clear and obvious error as there is no way that would ever be given without VAR. There weren't even any appeals from Czech players, and what has happened here is what we always say shouldn't happen, the match officials have shocked everyone as not a single person was expecting a penalty.

I don't blame the referee though as in UEFA sanctioned games if a referee is sent to look at the screen they almost always go with the VAR recommendation, it is extremely rare that they stick with their decision and I get the impression they are told they must not.
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One thing's for sure. The issue of players jumping with their arms for leverage has always been around and isn't going anywhere. We as Refs are obviously polarised on the subject so that's not great. I agree with @Jacktscallaghan , the brocken snout leaves the culprit in the brown stuff

But the comp has been well refereed and VAR has been fairly quiet. Be good if it stays that way
 
Jacktscallaghan said:
it’s pure chance whose face took a blow in that situation.
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Schick jumps in a way that makes no contact with Lovren's head in any way, Lovren draws his elbow back and smashes Schick in the nose. One was not dangerous in any way, shape or form. One was.
 
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Big Cat said:
One thing's for sure. The issue of players jumping with their arms for leverage has always been around and isn't going anywhere. We as Refs are obviously polarised on the subject so that's not great. I agree with @Jacktscallaghan , the brocken snout leaves the culprit in the brown stuff

But the comp has been well refereed and VAR has been fairly quiet. Be good if it stays that way
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Yeah it isn’t ideal that even us refs can’t agree is it? 😅
 
Jacktscallaghan said:
It’s clearly a matter of opinion. We don’t need the derogative laughing emojis.
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I put the laughing emojis because I literally laughed out loud at the suggestion that anyone could watch that back and suggest that it was "pure chance" which player got smashed in the face in that incident. If you don't think it's a foul then fine, but trying to argue that what Schick did was "similar" to Lovren is IMO ludicrous.
 
Careless at worst (Lovren has ducked his head and has mistimed his jump for the ball looking at replay)

Kyle Walker got penalised vs Tunisia I the last World Cup for a careless arm in the face too. Suffice to say in the UK, we’d play on. Elsewhere it’s an 11metre job
 
Tealeaf said:
Suffice to say in the UK, we’d play on.
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Going purely on vague memory I'm sure there were several occasions last season in the PL where yellow cards were given for players jumping for headers with their arms extended and making contact with the opponent's head.
 
Alex Rush-Fear said:
Going purely on vague memory I'm sure there were several occasions last season in the PL where yellow cards were given for players jumping for headers with their arms extended and making contact with the opponent's head.
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Not in the penalty area though, and certainly not when there are no appeals for a foul.

I think Croatia were a bit unlucky it was Spanish officials, they have always been a lot stricter around use of arms. I'm pretty sure if that was a Norwegian, English, German, Swedish, etc, VAR it wouldn't have been referred.
 
His style is very dismissive and patronising - I only switched on 15 mins in and already I've seen him give a hb against sterling having spun to look the other way, and an excessive use of the whistle to signal a simple throw. Zero attempt to achieve low profile refereeing!
 
GraemeS said:
His style is very dismissive and patronising - I only switched on 15 mins in and already I've seen him give a hb against sterling having spun to look the other way, and an excessive use of the whistle to signal a simple throw. Zero attempt to achieve low profile refereeing!
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The last of the mavericks.
He is retiring after this tournament.
 
Two advantages played for pulls on Mount by Gilmore on the same run; bring back interfering with a promising attack for pulls.

Second one effectively stopped the attack as he had to stop and pass sideways.
 
Rubbish game again. The 24 team format makes for criminally conservative football. England really don't need two DMs. Really miss Henderson's passing. Ref was too arrogant in the first half.
 
bester said:
Two advantages played for pulls on Mount by Gilmore on the same run; bring back interfering with a promising attack for pulls.

Second one effectively stopped the attack as he had to stop and pass sideways.
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Foil given against Gilmore that stopped a promising attack, still not booked.
 
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